Dem bicicletas dos, doe.

[coogles]

I take a look at TPC from time to time and I have zero interest in buying anything from them.

I'll buy a brand new bike (or have one built) before I spend that kind of coin on a used one. At least I can get a Carfax on a vehicle.

Plan right now is to do up another custom Blacklist this winter - mimicking the geo from the CAAD. I love the way that bike fits me. Ultegra disc, TA front and rear, carbon bars, Thomson cockpit, room for 32s max.

I think we are just in an unprecedented time where people would be willing to buy something like that Trance for original MSRP because it's the only bike they can get their hands on. It seems like shit margins even at that point, but whatever, if it works for them.

I've heard the only reason to buy is if there's a bike that has some upgrades... like you may get a five year old bike for MSRP but you're getting some wheel upgrade thrown in or something along those lines.

Original MSRP was $5,100, I'd be beyond shocked if they list it for that. But I'd guess it'll go up for at least $3,500.

[troyguitar]

Aww yeah.

[rockchops]

Aww yeah.

Sandals like that require white calf socks, hombre.

2 stripes for extra points

[coogles]

Well, this explains the Strava on Monday.



New FTP: 351W

I retested a couple days ago. 203W

[coogles]

Well, its a move in the right direction!

Some real road miles will help, I guarantee it.

Gotta buy a bike first, just call me

Continuing the geometry talk a bit, I did the Competitive Cyclist bike fit calculator and it said I need a 56cm seat tube, but like a 52.5cm top tube. That bike...doesn't exist. Makes sense I guess, my 5'6" wife and I look each other in the eye when we sit down, but I'm 4" taller. Not as leggy as you, but still very much more leg than torso. Makes me wonder how you handle the reach on a 58 at 5'11", doe.

I guess I'll just see how the Emonda feels, it's supposed to come in sometime next week.

[coogles]

Well, if my torso matched my legs, I'd be on a 60-61" frame.

I need a shorter top tube as well, which is why I love the CAAD so much. It's fairly short in the cockpit compared to many bikes of a similar size.

Go to geometrygeeks.bike and plug in some bikes and compare.

You can fine tune a bit with shorter/longer stems, and setback/non-setback seatposts too.

Thanks, I'll check that out. I think I'm coming to the conclusion I should start off on an endurance bike, though. I already tried the race bike geometry in a 54, and the drop to the bars is more than I'm comfortable with, even without removing any spacers. I'm much more comfortable with the drop on a 56, which at least is confirmed by what the bike fit calculator is telling me, but then the reach is too long. I guess I could go from a 100mm stem to an 80 or 90, but I'd think that could make an already quick-handling bike twitchy. Going with a Domane/Synapse/Roubaix or the like might work out better since they are a little shorter in the reach and have taller head tubes.

[troyguitar]

Well, its a move in the right direction!

Some real road miles will help, I guarantee it.

Gotta buy a bike first, just call me

Continuing the geometry talk a bit, I did the Competitive Cyclist bike fit calculator and it said I need a 56cm seat tube, but like a 52.5cm top tube. That bike...doesn't exist. Makes sense I guess, my 5'6" wife and I look each other in the eye when we sit down, but I'm 4" taller. Not as leggy as you, but still very much more leg than torso. Makes me wonder how you handle the reach on a 58 at 5'11", doe.

I guess I'll just see how the Emonda feels, it's supposed to come in sometime next week.

You can always run a long seat post on a smaller bike, mine sticks way up and it's great to have that extra flex anyway IMO.

I'm biased but I really like the flexibility of having a bike that's about one size "too small" - you can always move the bars and seat further from the frame when you are starting with a smaller frame. Stems are $25.

My superx has a 52.4cm top tube, by the way...

[coogles]

I've got a friend on a Domane and he loves it - that being said, the Emonda ALR might be right where you need it to be. It does have the H2 geometry (taller head tube) you're looking for.

I'm hoping so. The 56cm carbon H2 Emonda I hopped on a couple years ago (seriously kicking myself for not buying it) seemed like a perfect fit at the time, but I just put together my own little geometry comparison chart and it's really not much different from the CAAD13 at all. 2mm taller stack, 2mm shorter reach, head tube is 6mm taller and the top tube is 2mm shorter. Super minimal differences - not sure what I was looking at when I thought the Emonda had a much taller stack, I probably looked at the wrong size. But that makes me think the setback seatpost really is what caused the odd feeling on the CAAD, since the Emonda has a 0 offset seatpost. TBD.

[coogles]

Gotta buy a bike first, just call me

Continuing the geometry talk a bit, I did the Competitive Cyclist bike fit calculator and it said I need a 56cm seat tube, but like a 52.5cm top tube. That bike...doesn't exist. Makes sense I guess, my 5'6" wife and I look each other in the eye when we sit down, but I'm 4" taller. Not as leggy as you, but still very much more leg than torso. Makes me wonder how you handle the reach on a 58 at 5'11", doe.

I guess I'll just see how the Emonda feels, it's supposed to come in sometime next week.

You can always run a long seat post on a smaller bike, mine sticks way up and it's great to have that extra flex anyway IMO.

I'm biased but I really like the flexibility of having a bike that's about one size "too small" - you can always move the bars and seat further from the frame when you are starting with a smaller frame. Stems are $25.

My superx has a 52.4cm top tube, by the way...

I definitely wouldn't go below a 54 with my leg length, the amount of rise in the stem I'd need to get the bars to an appropriate place would be crazy on a 52.

[troyguitar]

Sounds like you basically need a ~54cm fairly upright endurance bike, think Trek H3 fit, with a tall (but not long) stem.

I also run my seat really far forward like on a TT bike. Zero offset post and even mounted forward on the post. It's supposed to be less comfortable but I prefer it that way.

[coogles]

Sounds like you basically need a ~54cm fairly upright endurance bike, think Trek H3 fit, with a tall (but not long) stem.

I also run my seat really far forward like on a TT bike. Zero offset post and even mounted forward on the post. It's supposed to be less comfortable but I prefer it that way.

You might be right on the first part. I set up the Peloton with the back of my kneecap plumb with the axle of the pedal at 3 o'clock and while I don't know exactly how that would translate to a bike, I don't think it would involve moving the saddle forward.

[troyguitar]

Sounds like you basically need a ~54cm fairly upright endurance bike, think Trek H3 fit, with a tall (but not long) stem.

I also run my seat really far forward like on a TT bike. Zero offset post and even mounted forward on the post. It's supposed to be less comfortable but I prefer it that way.

You might be right on the first part. I set up the Peloton with the back of my kneecap plumb with the axle of the pedal at 3 o'clock and while I don't know exactly how that would translate to a bike, I don't think it would involve moving the saddle forward.

For you the forward saddle is probably not a good thing since you fit basically the opposite of me with my long arms and short legs. It does sound like a very "relaxed" geometry, like H3 not H2, will be closer to effectively neutral for you.

I'm on the other end of the spectrum where an aggressive fit is more neutral for me, hence my 51 and 52 cm bikes.

[troyguitar]

FWIW, though, the knee vs pedal spindle rule of thumb is only a starting point. There's no science supporting it, so feel free to experiment with moving fore and aft.

[coogles]

You might be right on the first part. I set up the Peloton with the back of my kneecap plumb with the axle of the pedal at 3 o'clock and while I don't know exactly how that would translate to a bike, I don't think it would involve moving the saddle forward.

For you the forward saddle is probably not a good thing since you fit basically the opposite of me with my long arms and short legs. It does sound like a very "relaxed" geometry, like H3 not H2, will be closer to effectively neutral for you.

I'm on the other end of the spectrum where an aggressive fit is more neutral for me, hence my 51 and 52 cm bikes.

I don't have short arms, though, just a short torso and pretty sloped shoulders. My wingspan is just over 6'0", so a little more than 2" longer than my height. Who knows, the Emonda may be just different enough that I feel comfortable - definitely hoping that's the case. This LBS is a little family-owned joint and they're the nicest people ever. If I'm going to buy a new bike, I'd much rather support this place than REI.

[coogles]

FWIW, though, the knee vs pedal spindle rule of thumb is only a starting point. There's no science supporting it, so feel free to experiment with moving fore and aft.

Fair, although I did play with saddle height and fore/aft position a decent amount before settling in to where I am now on the Peloton, and I'm three notches/letters back on the saddle rail. I've spent enough time in that position that I can pretty quickly tell if the saddle isn't in the right (my preferred) spot now.

I did talk to a Spesh shop here in town that does the Retul fittings, and I guess you can do a blank-slate fitting on their bike. It'll essentially get you your ideal/preferred riding position, and then theoretically you could take that and find a frame that would allow you to get into that position. It's $300, but might be worth considering.

[coogles]

You’ll laugh at my Peloton position.

Saddle: 34/C.5
Handlebar height: a

34? Jeebus. I'm at 25, halfway between B&C, but I've brought the saddle down over time as I've turned more into a heels-down pedaler. why, maybe because I rode flats on the MTB and just got used to being that way. When I did my CAAD10 fitting I remember the guy commenting about how toes-down I was, and now I'm the total opposite.

[troyguitar]

34? Jeebus. I'm at 25, halfway between B&C, but I've brought the saddle down over time as I've turned more into a heels-down pedaler. why, maybe because I rode flats on the MTB and just got used to being that way. When I did my CAAD10 fitting I remember the guy commenting about how toes-down I was, and now I'm the total opposite.

I was at B.5 but we just slid the saddle forward to mitigate an issue with the saddle clamp bolt rubbing on the inside of the wife's thigh during rides. So, now it's C.5.

But yeah, long legs require a long seatpost for this boi. I took whatever my pedal to saddle measurement was on my CAAD and transferred it over to the Peloton. It's 90-91 cm, IIRC.

Whoa. I don't know about pedals but I'm ~75-76cm from the BB center to the top of the saddle, measured along the saddlepost. I guess add 17cm for crank length, minus pedal+shoe height, and we aren't actually that different?

[troyguitar]

FWIW, though, the knee vs pedal spindle rule of thumb is only a starting point. There's no science supporting it, so feel free to experiment with moving fore and aft.

Fair, although I did play with saddle height and fore/aft position a decent amount before settling in to where I am now on the Peloton, and I'm three notches/letters back on the saddle rail. I've spent enough time in that position that I can pretty quickly tell if the saddle isn't in the right (my preferred) spot now.

I did talk to a Spesh shop here in town that does the Retul fittings, and I guess you can do a blank-slate fitting on their bike. It'll essentially get you your ideal/preferred riding position, and then theoretically you could take that and find a frame that would allow you to get into that position. It's $300, but might be worth considering.

I think that playing with all of the variables over time is the only way to go if you're not a pro and are also not mechanically incompetent.

It's harder to buy a bike that way, though, as you know. Same thing with buying a car... Will it feel great with good tires/shocks/alignment?

[troyguitar]

I think that playing with all of the variables over time is the only way to go if you're not a pro and are also not mechanically incompetent.

It's harder to buy a bike that way, though, as you know. Same thing with buying a car... Will it feel great with good tires/shocks/alignment?

Yeah, I rode a Giant TCR and was kinda disappointed. Felt really heavy compared to the CAAD.

My bike transformed entirely by changing wheels+tarz. I guess if you test ride a spec then it is less of an issue.

Do you know anything about aero stuff or older bikes in general vs newer stuff? I'm kind of looking at yet interesting more stuff and saw, for example, an old Scott Foil from ~2012 w/ 10-speed Ultegra Di2 at a seemingly reasonable price. Dunno whether 10 year old aero tech is even worth considering.

[SAWCE]

Bicycle brethren. I’ve still been eyeing the All City Space Horse that one of you suggested I look at. Question though, when comparing the GRX to the Tiagra, is the GRX worth the extra $500? That money gets you hydraulic disc brakes vs the standard mechanical disc brakes and GRX 400 or 600 groupset vs the standard Tiagra or FSW groupset.

[troyguitar]

IMO it's down to how much you care about resale value/ease. Mechanical discs is a niche that not as many people want to buy, but they work just fine and the tiagra vs grx shifting is otherwise pretty much identical.

[troyguitar]

Coogs, go buy this:



56cm carbon frame domane w/ ultegra 6700 for $1000 somewhere in MO. If it was closer I'd go buy it myself and slam the stem.

[SAWCE]

IMO it's down to how much you care about resale value/ease. Mechanical discs is a niche that not as many people want to buy, but they work just fine and the tiagra vs grx shifting is otherwise pretty much identical.

Thanks man! So sounds like for this to just be something I cruise around on that the basic bitch spec is the way to go.

[coogles]

Coogs, go buy this:



56cm carbon frame domane w/ ultegra 6700 for $1000 somewhere in MO. If it was closer I'd go buy it myself and slam the stem.

No Facebook, doe, and with the crazy family life around here too far to travel. Thanks, though.

[SAWCE]

Bicycle brethren. I’ve still been eyeing the All City Space Horse that one of you suggested I look at. Question though, when comparing the GRX to the Tiagra, is the GRX worth the extra $500? That money gets you hydraulic disc brakes vs the standard mechanical disc brakes and GRX 400 or 600 groupset vs the standard Tiagra or FSW groupset.

Only $500 more for hydros and better group set?



Also Tiagra ≠ GRX600.

GRX400 = 105, GRX600 = Ultegra.

I’d at least spring for the GRX400 spec and #sendit.

As someone who really doesn’t know any of this stuff, will it
A) be a noticeable difference
B) be cheaper to buy it like that up front than to buy the basic bitch spec and upgrade later if I feel I need them

Or is upgrading those things afterwards not an option?