Agreed.
Detroit Moves to the Woods?
interesting points. I am regularly exposed to the "country side" when visiting with the wife's family (which is fortunately way reduced). Frankly, a lot of what they are pissed about regulating really needs to be regulated. I would guess that my wife's dad/stepmom's footprint on the planet is at least 5X my wife and I's, despite both of us living in two person households. They literally burn all of their trash/wasate - cans, plastics, you name it, make a big fire and burn it all. They drive everywhere obviously, huge amounts of driving, all done in various despie having no real reason for They buy a ton of shit because they have so much space... and it all just ends up being burned... I guess I just have no patience for the country Trump people.Detroit wrote: ↑Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:37 amI think it's more complex than that. What I've personally witnessed is almost a tale of two countries. City folks want more .gov involvement and in many cases, I agree with it. But then rural areas want less and I agree with that as well. There are very different ways of life and while that's been the case forever, it seems the two are really starting to clash...which accounted for the rise of Trump. All the city people were excited about Biden's win, but it was way more mixed up here. This division isn't going away, and I hope we start to see some politicians who recognize that and act accordingly.Tarspin wrote: ↑Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:37 am I do agree that the government is way to intimate with it's citizens in an alarming way, and for personal gains. It is no wonder that people are sick of it and want change, be it in small towns or big cities. Sad that it always comes to complete systemic failures before real change takes place.
I think because rural people don't see smog like city people do, they don't see litter everywhere like city people do, they just don't believe that any of these things are real.
We could all benefit from some cross pollination/perspective, which is exactly what Chris is experiencing (and thus being less judgmental towards Trumpers than some others here would be).
Acting against Devil's Lettuce legalization is interesting. That one I do sort of understand, drug abuse really ruins a much higher percentage of lives in rural areas it seems. It isn't all that sensible as the lettuce is pretty harmless, but I can understand how you wind up in the "drugs are just bad" camp.
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Holy shit, that's some perspective. Burning trash? Excessive consumption?D Griff wrote: ↑Mon Jan 11, 2021 6:05 pminteresting points. I am regularly exposed to the "country side" when visiting with the wife's family (which is fortunately way reduced). Frankly, a lot of what they are pissed about regulating really needs to be regulated. I would guess that my wife's dad/stepmom's footprint on the planet is at least 5X my wife and I's, despite both of us living in two person households. They literally burn all of their trash/wasate - cans, plastics, you name it, make a big fire and burn it all. They drive everywhere obviously, huge amounts of driving, all done in various despie having no real reason for They buy a ton of shit because they have so much space... and it all just ends up being burned... I guess I just have no patience for the country Trump people.Detroit wrote: ↑Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:37 am
I think it's more complex than that. What I've personally witnessed is almost a tale of two countries. City folks want more .gov involvement and in many cases, I agree with it. But then rural areas want less and I agree with that as well. There are very different ways of life and while that's been the case forever, it seems the two are really starting to clash...which accounted for the rise of Trump. All the city people were excited about Biden's win, but it was way more mixed up here. This division isn't going away, and I hope we start to see some politicians who recognize that and act accordingly.
I think because rural people don't see smog like city people do, they don't see litter everywhere like city people do, they just don't believe that any of these things are real.
We could all benefit from some cross pollination/perspective, which is exactly what Chris is experiencing (and thus being less judgmental towards Trumpers than some others here would be).
Acting against Devil's Lettuce legalization is interesting. That one I do sort of understand, drug abuse really ruins a much higher percentage of lives in rural areas it seems. It isn't all that sensible as the lettuce is pretty harmless, but I can understand how you wind up in the "drugs are just bad" camp.
Excessive consumption is a problem for this entire country. So is emissions and waste disposal. I would argue that it's more of a concern in areas with higher population density, but it's really something we all need to work together to solve. and that's the fundamental problem, it's hard to care about things you can't see and/or don't directly impact you. Burning trash is NBD when the next house is acres away, or so it seems.
My point is that there is a massive perspective gap on both sides driving a wedge. I wish it wasn't political but rather urban vs rural, but that's not an option these days I guess.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
Definitely agree, but it is proven that the more urban the environment the less people consume. If you live in an apartment, you're sharing the heating/cooling burden between hundreds of other dwellers in the building. You don't have a 200 sq. ft. walk in closet to fill with new shoes and clothes every day. You walk to work or take public transit rather than drive. The further from cities people get (generally), the more they consume/waste in energy/fuel. The wealthy far out white flight suburbia dwellers in 5K sq. ft. homes are probably the worst with their 120 mile round trip commutes, five CF and massive homes.Detroit wrote: ↑Mon Jan 11, 2021 7:32 pmHoly shit, that's some perspective. Burning trash? Excessive consumption?D Griff wrote: ↑Mon Jan 11, 2021 6:05 pm
interesting points. I am regularly exposed to the "country side" when visiting with the wife's family (which is fortunately way reduced). Frankly, a lot of what they are pissed about regulating really needs to be regulated. I would guess that my wife's dad/stepmom's footprint on the planet is at least 5X my wife and I's, despite both of us living in two person households. They literally burn all of their trash/wasate - cans, plastics, you name it, make a big fire and burn it all. They drive everywhere obviously, huge amounts of driving, all done in various despie having no real reason for They buy a ton of shit because they have so much space... and it all just ends up being burned... I guess I just have no patience for the country Trump people.
I think because rural people don't see smog like city people do, they don't see litter everywhere like city people do, they just don't believe that any of these things are real.
We could all benefit from some cross pollination/perspective, which is exactly what Chris is experiencing (and thus being less judgmental towards Trumpers than some others here would be).
Acting against Devil's Lettuce legalization is interesting. That one I do sort of understand, drug abuse really ruins a much higher percentage of lives in rural areas it seems. It isn't all that sensible as the lettuce is pretty harmless, but I can understand how you wind up in the "drugs are just bad" camp.
Excessive consumption is a problem for this entire country. So is emissions and waste disposal. I would argue that it's more of a concern in areas with higher population density, but it's really something we all need to work together to solve. and that's the fundamental problem, it's hard to care about things you can't see and/or don't directly impact you. Burning trash is NBD when the next house is acres away, or so it seems.
My point is that there is a massive perspective gap on both sides driving a wedge. I wish it wasn't political but rather urban vs rural, but that's not an option these days I guess.
Hopefully our country can do more to help everyone gain perspective. It's funny in this age of the internet how little so many of us still have. I do really like Troy's idea of a year of community service post high school (or maybe senior year) in a community totally different than where you've grown up, but that will never happen. Even if it was completely volutary, I bet many teens would welcome the opportunity to live/work somewhere for free with no strings attached and see a bit more of the world.
Education is also key. My in-laws really have no idea that burning all of their trash is awful I don't think. If you walk outside everyday and it's the freshest of air because you're miles from the nearest gas station/store/anything, it just doesn't occur to you, and Fox News isn't sharing that info with them either.
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That last part is what I was getting at with my overall concern. People in rural areas are only exposed to the "news" and "issues" that directly concern them, and repeatedly downplay the issues that they can't verify with their own eyes (like pollution). And while pollution certainly doesn't impact their direct living situation, it does impact the world overall. Making people care about others when they can't see them is near impossible.D Griff wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 8:39 amDefinitely agree, but it is proven that the more urban the environment the less people consume. If you live in an apartment, you're sharing the heating/cooling burden between hundreds of other dwellers in the building. You don't have a 200 sq. ft. walk in closet to fill with new shoes and clothes every day. You walk to work or take public transit rather than drive. The further from cities people get (generally), the more they consume/waste in energy/fuel. The wealthy far out white flight suburbia dwellers in 5K sq. ft. homes are probably the worst with their 120 mile round trip commutes, five CF and massive homes.Detroit wrote: ↑Mon Jan 11, 2021 7:32 pm
Holy shit, that's some perspective. Burning trash? Excessive consumption?
Excessive consumption is a problem for this entire country. So is emissions and waste disposal. I would argue that it's more of a concern in areas with higher population density, but it's really something we all need to work together to solve. and that's the fundamental problem, it's hard to care about things you can't see and/or don't directly impact you. Burning trash is NBD when the next house is acres away, or so it seems.
My point is that there is a massive perspective gap on both sides driving a wedge. I wish it wasn't political but rather urban vs rural, but that's not an option these days I guess.
Hopefully our country can do more to help everyone gain perspective. It's funny in this age of the internet how little so many of us still have. I do really like Troy's idea of a year of community service post high school (or maybe senior year) in a community totally different than where you've grown up, but that will never happen. Even if it was completely volutary, I bet many teens would welcome the opportunity to live/work somewhere for free with no strings attached and see a bit more of the world.
Education is also key. My in-laws really have no idea that burning all of their trash is awful I don't think. If you walk outside everyday and it's the freshest of air because you're miles from the nearest gas station/store/anything, it just doesn't occur to you, and Fox News isn't sharing that info with them either.
Trump basically validated their viewpoints of how the world as they see it is fine and everyone else is just whining babies part of "the machine" or whatever. With Trump going away (maybe), the bigger issue of the underlying sentiment doesn't go away...in fact these people will likely feel alienated and more likely to lash out or cling harder to the "truths" that they believe. This is what concerns me the most, that the pendulum will swing too far in the opposite direction and cause for more issues.
I never ever realized this when I lived near the city. It's incredibly how valuable it can be understanding the other side. I don't agree with it, but understand.
And it's also important to not lump people in geographic areas together. We live in an area with educated wealthy people who are incredibly environmentally and socially conscious. They moved to the woods for the same reason we did, to be part of nature and slow down. A few of my neighbors even traded their garbage bins for extra recycling bins. I asked them about it, and one lady said that they produce zero garbage. They only buy things that come in recyclable containers...and even wash the containers before recycling (because some food containers can't be recycled if dirty/greasy), compost all food waste, and they buy second hand furniture and donate what they no longer need. Stark contrast to others who burn their trash.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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I don't think it should be forced, rather optional for people to chose. And instead of community service, it should be free community college or trade school tuition in an area very different to your own with the option to stay with a host family or some sort of school housing. A Domestic Exchange Student program, if you will. I really think it would go a long way toward closing the giant gap we've developed as a country.[user not found] wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:15 am A year of post-education community service? Sounds pretty communist.
Also, that's a slippery slope that could quickly turn into post-education military service in this country, which is definitely communist.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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I hope some leader somewhere recognizes that this us vs them battle mentality is going to drive this country straight to civil war type things. I'm still amazed by the difference of urban vs rural living, at least in Michigan (which actually seems to be one of the most extreme cases).[user not found] wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:02 amIt honestly sounds great in theory.Detroit wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:47 am
I don't think it should be forced, rather optional for people to chose. And instead of community service, it should be free community college or trade school tuition in an area very different to your own with the option to stay with a host family or some sort of school housing. A Domestic Exchange Student program, if you will. I really think it would go a long way toward closing the giant gap we've developed as a country.
I think bridging the divides is an important thing to do. Giving people perspective is paramount.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
Michigan really doesn't sound any different than here. NC went from a very red state to purple as Charlotte and the Raleigh area have grown. Now the rural reds hate city people, make fun of us, and think we are the cause of all of these problems because we "want to give poors/blacks free shit" and the like. Meanwhile, they don't realize that the cities are the ones paying all of the taxes. In their defense though, the cities are also the ones getting new infrastructure, nice parks, you name it.Detroit wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:08 amI hope some leader somewhere recognizes that this us vs them battle mentality is going to drive this country straight to civil war type things. I'm still amazed by the difference of urban vs rural living, at least in Michigan (which actually seems to be one of the most extreme cases).[user not found] wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:02 am
It honestly sounds great in theory.
I think bridging the divides is an important thing to do. Giving people perspective is paramount.
I am such a believer in getting out of your local area and experiencing how other people live because I went through that and learned so much. I started as a suburban Catholic school kid with a very narrow view. I moved to Miami and was . It was scary at first, but I learned so much, and then even more working on the road and meeting with people all over North America. Not everyone has access to that, but it would be nice to have .gov assisted options to learn not only in school but in person.
Say you are interested in engineering - offer free community college on the subject, but to pay for it, require some sort of work study job with local .gov.
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Was there a group of extremists in NC that had their plot to kidnap the governor serious enough to be thwarted by the FBI? BTW, Michigan voted dem in 2018 (governor) and 2020 (president). That's some radical difference...and those dudes were one county over from ours, a county that's full of lakes and rich people's lake mansions (including the governor).D Griff wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:09 pmMichigan really doesn't sound any different than here. NC went from a very red state to purple as Charlotte and the Raleigh area have grown. Now the rural reds hate city people, make fun of us, and think we are the cause of all of these problems because we "want to give poors/blacks free shit" and the like. Meanwhile, they don't realize that the cities are the ones paying all of the taxes. In their defense though, the cities are also the ones getting new infrastructure, nice parks, you name it.Detroit wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:08 am
I hope some leader somewhere recognizes that this us vs them battle mentality is going to drive this country straight to civil war type things. I'm still amazed by the difference of urban vs rural living, at least in Michigan (which actually seems to be one of the most extreme cases).
I am such a believer in getting out of your local area and experiencing how other people live because I went through that and learned so much. I started as a suburban Catholic school kid with a very narrow view. I moved to Miami and was . It was scary at first, but I learned so much, and then even more working on the road and meeting with people all over North America. Not everyone has access to that, but it would be nice to have .gov assisted options to learn not only in school but in person.
Say you are interested in engineering - offer free community college on the subject, but to pay for it, require some sort of work study job with local .gov.
Perspective is huge, I'd love to see it spread.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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[user not found] wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:15 am A year of post-education community service? Sounds pretty communist.
Also, that's a slippery slope that could quickly turn into post-education military service in this country, which is definitely communist.
Several Western democracies have compulsory military service requirements.
Plenty of shithole countries, but some 5/7 free societies, too.
Countries with mandatory military service
3.1 Armenia
3.2 Austria
3.3 Azerbaijan
3.4 Belarus
3.5 Bermuda
3.6 Brazil
3.7 Myanmar
3.8 Cyprus
3.9 Denmark
3.10 Egypt
3.11 Finland
3.12 Greece
3.13 Iran
3.14 Israel
3.15 Mexico
3.16 Morocco
3.17 North Korea
3.18 Norway
3.19 Russia
3.20 Singapore
3.21 South Korea
3.21.1 Compensation
3.22 Switzerland
3.23 Taiwan
3.24 Thailand
3.25 Tunisia
3.26 Turkey
3.27 Ukraine
3.28 United Arab Emirates
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update time!
In a small house, making rooms multipurpose is critical. Our guest room is now an office and workout room, downstairs bar is just a bar/chill room with a gas stove, and our living room has epic windows and views outside. We didn't have anywhere to logically place a TV, and being stuck inside for a number of months out of the year and being somewhat movie buffs, this was a problem
Our friend who had the house before had a TV blocking the windows in the middle. When we first moved in we had a TV to the right there in the corner, blocking that entire window. I've always wanted to install a projector somewhere, and the house provided the perfect opportunity for a roll-down screen. The screen is actually installed in that picture above.
See it now?
The hardest part about installing a projector is the need to get the room as dark as possible so the image doesn't get washed out. I was planning on installing powered blackout shades to the windows, but then discovered new ambient light rejecting (ALR) screens that promise to alleviate that need. I picked up a 120" powered rolling ALR screen from Griff and his company, incidentally one of the only companies that make roll down screens with that material. The above picture was taken yesterday in the middle of the afternoon with snow flying, creating lots of ambient light. At night, we can leave lights on and watch a movie without issue. It's really how well it works.
Paired with a BenQ TK800m 4k projector (that's one of the brighter projectors on the market), and a Sonos Arc with Sub and Syfonisk speaker surrounds, it's a legit theater. It turned out better than I thought, and the best being the hidden element. It makes the living room a true dual purpose living room. Views of nature during the day, movie theater at night.
In a small house, making rooms multipurpose is critical. Our guest room is now an office and workout room, downstairs bar is just a bar/chill room with a gas stove, and our living room has epic windows and views outside. We didn't have anywhere to logically place a TV, and being stuck inside for a number of months out of the year and being somewhat movie buffs, this was a problem
Our friend who had the house before had a TV blocking the windows in the middle. When we first moved in we had a TV to the right there in the corner, blocking that entire window. I've always wanted to install a projector somewhere, and the house provided the perfect opportunity for a roll-down screen. The screen is actually installed in that picture above.
See it now?
The hardest part about installing a projector is the need to get the room as dark as possible so the image doesn't get washed out. I was planning on installing powered blackout shades to the windows, but then discovered new ambient light rejecting (ALR) screens that promise to alleviate that need. I picked up a 120" powered rolling ALR screen from Griff and his company, incidentally one of the only companies that make roll down screens with that material. The above picture was taken yesterday in the middle of the afternoon with snow flying, creating lots of ambient light. At night, we can leave lights on and watch a movie without issue. It's really how well it works.
Paired with a BenQ TK800m 4k projector (that's one of the brighter projectors on the market), and a Sonos Arc with Sub and Syfonisk speaker surrounds, it's a legit theater. It turned out better than I thought, and the best being the hidden element. It makes the living room a true dual purpose living room. Views of nature during the day, movie theater at night.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Yea, I was standing next to where we watch...the wall behind had ugly floor to ceiling mirrors that I took down and we need paint the wood behind it, so I held off on photos.
We've got a lux depth restoration hardware couch that's 5/7 to lounge on.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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My brother ran into the same issues with getting a woodburning stove. They've effectively placed catylytic converters on them that make the less efficient and they have almost doubled in price for the privelege.... He finally found one locally but he had to pick it up and bring it in the house himself ( no mean feat, it weighs about 500lbs)
He is very rural and historically there have been no real limitations on burning anything.... people burn their paper garbage ........and actually do controlled burns on their fields sometimes...... There are also no emissions testing on cars in his county ( and most counties in the blessed lands) ...... So it seems like BS to have to be forced to buy emmision reduced anything else where he lives.
He is very rural and historically there have been no real limitations on burning anything.... people burn their paper garbage ........and actually do controlled burns on their fields sometimes...... There are also no emissions testing on cars in his county ( and most counties in the blessed lands) ...... So it seems like BS to have to be forced to buy emmision reduced anything else where he lives.
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If you're trying to put a TV in a nice room, it's the way to go. I think TVs are ugly, and the screen basically makes the TV hidden when you want it to be. The picture is also better IMO.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Yep, this is the issue here and a massive from Trump's EPA. You also can't just burn any wood in these things, so the price of wood is more than natural gas. I imagine that's the goal...to push people to use natural gas that's cleaner...but that's not possible for large rural areas that still use propane.Irish wrote: ↑Tue Feb 16, 2021 4:59 pm My brother ran into the same issues with getting a woodburning stove. They've effectively placed catylytic converters on them that make the less efficient and they have almost doubled in price for the privelege.... He finally found one locally but he had to pick it up and bring it in the house himself ( no mean feat, it weighs about 500lbs)
He is very rural and historically there have been no real limitations on burning anything.... people burn their paper garbage ........and actually do controlled burns on their fields sometimes...... There are also no emissions testing on cars in his county ( and most counties in the blessed lands) ...... So it seems like BS to have to be forced to buy emmision reduced anything else where he lives.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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My friend who I'd be renting with to start already has a projector so this would be great for a large open living space
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Yea, it's fantastic. And I highly recommend doing an ALR screen. It legit works.
It's not as bright as a TV with a ton of ambient light like in the middle of the day, but damn is it effective. Can leave lights on and watch a movie.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.