DFD

I'm not a fan of debt, prefer to live my life debt free. Saying this though, the money that I don't have tied up in my primary residence has grown disproportionately over the years. The counter-argument of home debt is what we're seeing now. Anyone who has to refi at or near 5% should be making moves to eliminate that debt ASAP.

Canadians have a culture of taking low interest 5 yr loans that amortize over 25 yrs, it helps to reduce debts and has traditionally beat the 30 yr loan. In today's world affair, anyone who locked in a 30 yr at 3 or whatever % interest is well served, no need to pay that bitch down anytime soon. The answer to this age-old question comes down to individual circumstances IMHO

Tar wrote: ↑Thu May 04, 2023 5:34 pm I'm not a fan of debt, prefer to live my life debt free. Saying this though, the money that I don't have tied up in my primary residence has grown disproportionately over the years. The counter-argument of home debt is what we're seeing now. Anyone who has to refi at or near 5% should be making moves to eliminate that debt ASAP.

Canadians have a culture of taking low interest 5 yr loans that amortize over 25 yrs, it helps to reduce debts and has traditionally beat the 30 yr loan. In today's world affair, anyone who locked in a 30 yr at 3 or whatever % interest is well served, no need to pay that bitch down anytime soon. The answer to this age-old question comes down to individual circumstances IMHO

Y’all are at 5%? We’re at 7…

max225 wrote: ↑Thu May 04, 2023 5:42 pm

Tar wrote: ↑Thu May 04, 2023 5:34 pm I'm not a fan of debt, prefer to live my life debt free. Saying this though, the money that I don't have tied up in my primary residence has grown disproportionately over the years. The counter-argument of home debt is what we're seeing now. Anyone who has to refi at or near 5% should be making moves to eliminate that debt ASAP.

Canadians have a culture of taking low interest 5 yr loans that amortize over 25 yrs, it helps to reduce debts and has traditionally beat the 30 yr loan. In today's world affair, anyone who locked in a 30 yr at 3 or whatever % interest is well served, no need to pay that bitch down anytime soon. The answer to this age-old question comes down to individual circumstances IMHO

Y’all are at 5%? We’re at 7…

Yeah I can lock in around 4.xx for a 5 yr term. My primary residence still has 18 months at 2.49%, but the investment prop is riding a variable rate up to 5.15% currently. I'm sure if I tried to secure a 30 yr it would be higher, not sure how much higher TBH. The economy is going to puke soon, so I'm just going to ride the trend downwards....... Hopefully

Unfortunately, it's going to take a long time to unwind the mess ZIRP created. It's going to be years and years of pain.

So here's a question/observation for the class:

I partake in our company employee stock purchase program. It goes in six months intervals. I put in the max, 15% of my check, and then at the end of six months, they buy me that dollar amount in stock at the lower price of the first or last day of that six months with a 15% discount on top. This ends during an open selling period for employees every time, so my thinking is, put in the 15% and worst case scenario I get an extra 15% on top of the pay, best case it's more than that. Sell it at the end of each six month period.

I did rather well this time around bought at $6.60/stock and sold at $9.30, total was about 1,600 shares.

What I've been doing is setting it to sell at a certain amount once I get it at the end of each six month period. So I got the stock this time a couple of weeks ago and it was at $8.75 but had hovered in the mid nines mostly for a bit, so I set it up to auto sell once it hit $9.30, which I chose rather arbitrarily.

Is there any good way to gauge this number per share I should hope for? If it hadn't hit $9.30, I would've probably just ended up selling it on 6/16 for whatever when the open trading window ended. That said it went up as high as $9.75 today, so if I should've tried for more. I just don't want to wind up stuck with this stock for six months...

Your trading window is only open once every 6 months ? That doesn’t sound right. Usually it opens day after earnings and closes after 1-2 months into the quarter for most cucks

max225 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 07, 2023 8:06 pm Your trading window is only open once every 6 months ? That doesn’t sound right. Usually it opens day after earnings and closes after 1-2 months into the quarter for most cucks

No I think you're right actually. So I guess it's open for a month or two quarterly? Even still, I don't really want to hold stock of the company at all... and I both work at this place, I feel like that is too heavily invested as it is. I honestly don't envision this company outperforming the market or anything, seems like it's gotten more poorly run as we've grown and some of the acquisitions are duds.

I guess my question is, am I for thinking this? Is there any strategy in holding the stocks a bit longer at times to try to capitalize or just continue pumping and dumping and taking the immediate 15+% profit? Pump and dump has netted me $5-6K extra income over the past year, which is honestly decent, 2X my last raise

No, immediately sell and put into robo-investing. There's zero reason to open yourself up to additional risk by being so heavily invested in a single company. But it's even worse than that. Not only would you be heavily invested in a single company, but it's the same company that gives you a paycheck! If they were to take a dive, and you also lose your job, you're mega screwed. It's tons of additional risk for not upside.

Just need to weigh the return. Previous job has an employee stock purchase program, but I think it was only a 10% discount, and there was a holding period after execution. When you take into account the taxes associated with the transaction, and opportunity cost of tying up that cash, I wasn't outperforming just putting it in the market in general and stopped doing it. Really depends on what your terms are and how the math works out.

MrH42 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 1:38 pm No, immediately sell and put into robo-investing. There's zero reason to open yourself up to additional risk by being so heavily invested in a single company. But it's even worse than that. Not only would you be heavily invested in a single company, but it's the same company that gives you a paycheck! If they were to take a dive, and you also lose your job, you're mega screwed. It's tons of additional risk for not upside.

Just need to weigh the return. Previous job has an employee stock purchase program, but I think it was only a 10% discount, and there was a holding period after execution. When you take into account the taxes associated with the transaction, and opportunity cost of tying up that cash, I wasn't outperforming just putting it in the market in general and stopped doing it. Really depends on what your terms are and how the math works out.

Yep I definitely agree with the bolded. We get a 15% discount on top of getting it at the lower cost of the beginning or end of the period and can sell immediately. So I've been in it for two six month periods, one I got just the 15% discount (worst case), this one 30% so it seems worth it. It is also aligned to a trading window so I can immediately sell.

I am just cashing out though and not investing the money as we're already saving a lot in other areas, so this is just trying to get an extra $5-10K/year in income basically.

D Griff wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 3:17 pm

MrH42 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 1:38 pm No, immediately sell and put into robo-investing. There's zero reason to open yourself up to additional risk by being so heavily invested in a single company. But it's even worse than that. Not only would you be heavily invested in a single company, but it's the same company that gives you a paycheck! If they were to take a dive, and you also lose your job, you're mega screwed. It's tons of additional risk for not upside.

Just need to weigh the return. Previous job has an employee stock purchase program, but I think it was only a 10% discount, and there was a holding period after execution. When you take into account the taxes associated with the transaction, and opportunity cost of tying up that cash, I wasn't outperforming just putting it in the market in general and stopped doing it. Really depends on what your terms are and how the math works out.

Yep I definitely agree with the bolded. We get a 15% discount on top of getting it at the lower cost of the beginning or end of the period and can sell immediately. So I've been in it for two six month periods, one I got just the 15% discount (worst case), this one 30% so it seems worth it. It is also aligned to a trading window so I can immediately sell.

I am just cashing out though and not investing the money as we're already saving a lot in other areas, so this is just trying to get an extra $5-10K/year in income basically.

Yeah, makes sense. I would just do what you're doing: max it out and sell immediately. If you're saving for other things, here's what I'd do with the cash:

- If it's short term (likely needed in <1 year), money market account is at 4.55% right now and I can have it transferred in a couple of days max
- If it's more medium term (needed 1-3 years), bond market portfolio is at 5.66%
- Long term investments (3+ years), it just goes into my taxable investment account.

D Griff wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 3:17 pm

MrH42 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 1:38 pm No, immediately sell and put into robo-investing. There's zero reason to open yourself up to additional risk by being so heavily invested in a single company. But it's even worse than that. Not only would you be heavily invested in a single company, but it's the same company that gives you a paycheck! If they were to take a dive, and you also lose your job, you're mega screwed. It's tons of additional risk for not upside.

Just need to weigh the return. Previous job has an employee stock purchase program, but I think it was only a 10% discount, and there was a holding period after execution. When you take into account the taxes associated with the transaction, and opportunity cost of tying up that cash, I wasn't outperforming just putting it in the market in general and stopped doing it. Really depends on what your terms are and how the math works out.

Yep I definitely agree with the bolded. We get a 15% discount on top of getting it at the lower cost of the beginning or end of the period and can sell immediately. So I've been in it for two six month periods, one I got just the 15% discount (worst case), this one 30% so it seems worth it. It is also aligned to a trading window so I can immediately sell.

I am just cashing out though and not investing the money as we're already saving a lot in other areas, so this is just trying to get an extra $5-10K/year in income basically.

The only issue you're opening yourself up to here is short term capital gains vs long term. But you'd have to wait out another year... making the total almost 2 years between purchase and sale.

"Stocks turn lower, Treasury yields jump as Fed leaves rates unchanged, signals more hikes in pipeline"

roughrough

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/25-mcdon ... 12675.html

OMG i wonder if this could have been predicted somehow

golftdibrad1 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 9:10 am https://finance.yahoo.com/news/25-mcdon ... 12675.html

OMG i wonder if this could have been predicted somehow

Those $1000 stay home stay safe checks and PPP bailouts will be studied for generations

I'm just glad I'm too old to consider eating that shit in the first place.

I am down with Chipotle. I really don't go to places like Cava, Chipotle, etc. on my own dime but eat them on the road often. I have noticed the price creep, if you get a drink or side, you're definitely coming in a 20 bucks, which is definitely quite the price creep. Amazingly, Taco Bell still offers $5 boxes.

D Griff wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 11:45 am I am down with Chipotle. I really don't go to places like Cava, Chipotle, etc. on my own dime but eat them on the road often. I have noticed the price creep, if you get a drink or side, you're definitely coming in a 20 bucks, which is definitely quite the price creep. Amazingly, Taco Bell still offers $5 boxes.

Shows you how cheap the food always was at TB! Grade E dog food is like $.01/pound

J-Ho-Fo-Show69 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 11:50 am

D Griff wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 11:45 am I am down with Chipotle. I really don't go to places like Cava, Chipotle, etc. on my own dime but eat them on the road often. I have noticed the price creep, if you get a drink or side, you're definitely coming in a 20 bucks, which is definitely quite the price creep. Amazingly, Taco Bell still offers $5 boxes.

Shows you how cheap the food always was at TB! Grade E dog food is like $.01/pound

I don't eat the beef which really isn't great, but the tortillas, beans, lettuce, tomato, cheese, chicken, etc. are all about the same as anywhere else. I'd certainly rate it above Macdoe.

Been grabbing chipotle here and there.. my order right now to fit my macros is a salad with double chicken and pico de gallo Last time I got it the chick was cool and was like “that’s it? No toppings? I’m not going to charge you for a full salad.” Rang me up for two sides of chicken and I was out the door for like $6.. so now that I know I can order sides of their meat, I may do that in a pinch if I ever don’t have food prepped or out and about with me to keep it cheap.

I wondering if boomers will FUCK everyone in the stock market next.
1. They already fucked everyone with college tuition (They got it for $200 a year and current students are out 15>80k a year)
2. They fucked everyone on the pensions (they overloaded the system and made it unsustainable and yet drawing the benefits while no one else can join)
3. They fucked everyone to get free healthcare (overloading the system while paying 2 pennies per month, while a working fam is paying upwards of 4 figures)
4. They fucked/are fucking everyone with their real estate "investments" (holding homes purchased for 2 grapes and a fruit roll up, and juicing the rental homes airbnb market as "investments" constraining inventories, paying jack shit in prop taxes compared to anyone buying right now)


5. stonks have got to be next... the strategy always goes... PUMP early on... and reap the benefits long term while pricing/regulating everyone out of entering the market... (I am thinking the new taxes will completely obliterate those hoping to live off their investments, like unrealized cap gains, net investment tax etc, while they rode their wave)

Boomers are the first generation in history that not only is better off than the generation they replaced but also their kids/next generation,
Discuss.

max225 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:13 pm I wondering if boomers will FUCK everyone in the stock market next.
1. They already fucked everyone with college tuition (They got it for $200 a year and current students are out 15>80k a year)
2. They fucked everyone on the pensions (they overloaded the system and made it unsustainable and yet drawing the benefits while no one else can join)
3. They fucked everyone to get free healthcare (overloading the system while paying 2 pennies per month, while a working fam is paying upwards of 4 figures)
4. They fucked/are fucking everyone with their real estate "investments" (holding homes purchased for 2 grapes and a fruit roll up, and juicing the rental homes airbnb market as "investments" constraining inventories, paying jack shit in prop taxes compared to anyone buying right now)


5. stonks have got to be next... the strategy always goes... PUMP early on... and reap the benefits long term while pricing/regulating everyone out of entering the market... (I am thinking the new taxes will completely obliterate those hoping to live off their investments, like unrealized cap gains, net investment tax etc, while they rode their wave)

Boomers are the first generation in history that not only is better off than the generation they replaced but also their kids/next generation,
Discuss.

probably.

the real question is what happens when all that money gets pulled out as they die

golftdibrad1 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:18 pm

max225 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:13 pm I wondering if boomers will FUCK everyone in the stock market next.
1. They already fucked everyone with college tuition (They got it for $200 a year and current students are out 15>80k a year)
2. They fucked everyone on the pensions (they overloaded the system and made it unsustainable and yet drawing the benefits while no one else can join)
3. They fucked everyone to get free healthcare (overloading the system while paying 2 pennies per month, while a working fam is paying upwards of 4 figures)
4. They fucked/are fucking everyone with their real estate "investments" (holding homes purchased for 2 grapes and a fruit roll up, and juicing the rental homes airbnb market as "investments" constraining inventories, paying jack shit in prop taxes compared to anyone buying right now)


5. stonks have got to be next... the strategy always goes... PUMP early on... and reap the benefits long term while pricing/regulating everyone out of entering the market... (I am thinking the new taxes will completely obliterate those hoping to live off their investments, like unrealized cap gains, net investment tax etc, while they rode their wave)

Boomers are the first generation in history that not only is better off than the generation they replaced but also their kids/next generation,
Discuss.

probably.

the real question is what happens when all that money gets pulled out as they die

Taxed to the oblivion unless they were smart enough with trusts and other schemes to hide it.

max225 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:13 pm I wondering if boomers will FUCK everyone in the stock market next.
1. They already fucked everyone with college tuition (They got it for $200 a year and current students are out 15>80k a year)
2. They fucked everyone on the pensions (they overloaded the system and made it unsustainable and yet drawing the benefits while no one else can join)
3. They fucked everyone to get free healthcare (overloading the system while paying 2 pennies per month, while a working fam is paying upwards of 4 figures)
4. They fucked/are fucking everyone with their real estate "investments" (holding homes purchased for 2 grapes and a fruit roll up, and juicing the rental homes airbnb market as "investments" constraining inventories, paying jack shit in prop taxes compared to anyone buying right now)


5. stonks have got to be next... the strategy always goes... PUMP early on... and reap the benefits long term while pricing/regulating everyone out of entering the market... (I am thinking the new taxes will completely obliterate those hoping to live off their investments, like unrealized cap gains, net investment tax etc, while they rode their wave)

Boomers are the first generation in history that not only is better off than the generation they replaced but also their kids/next generation,
Discuss.

I love your boomer hate bro. It makes a lot more sense than hating Toyota price creep.

Desertbreh wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:21 pm

max225 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 2:13 pm I wondering if boomers will FUCK everyone in the stock market next.
1. They already fucked everyone with college tuition (They got it for $200 a year and current students are out 15>80k a year)
2. They fucked everyone on the pensions (they overloaded the system and made it unsustainable and yet drawing the benefits while no one else can join)
3. They fucked everyone to get free healthcare (overloading the system while paying 2 pennies per month, while a working fam is paying upwards of 4 figures)
4. They fucked/are fucking everyone with their real estate "investments" (holding homes purchased for 2 grapes and a fruit roll up, and juicing the rental homes airbnb market as "investments" constraining inventories, paying jack shit in prop taxes compared to anyone buying right now)


5. stonks have got to be next... the strategy always goes... PUMP early on... and reap the benefits long term while pricing/regulating everyone out of entering the market... (I am thinking the new taxes will completely obliterate those hoping to live off their investments, like unrealized cap gains, net investment tax etc, while they rode their wave)

Boomers are the first generation in history that not only is better off than the generation they replaced but also their kids/next generation,
Discuss.

I love your boomer hate bro. It makes a lot more sense than hating Toyota price creep.

They wonder why young people are not having kids. And one of the lowest birth rates on record. Because young folks are taxed/financially ruined to pay for the olds swimming in money.

For every young person trying to get educated it should come not from a cali nurse paying 55% in taxes but a boomer sitting in a 4 million dollar home that gets to pay $1400 a year in prop taxes. The system is completely fucked against us... and I am an old already... but clearly still suffering through it while my boomer neighbors are enjoying watching the world burn (literally and figuratively). Anyone under the age of 45 should not be paying anything over 20% in taxes... while anyone over 65 should really start to pay their fair share in order to fund the next generation as opposed to the other way around.

Why? How can that be fair?
1. They haven't paid their fair share or anywhere near that because everyone is paying for them NOW.
2. We need to ensure the best is coming to our next generations as opposed to crippling them with the legacies of the olds reaping all the benefits. Otherwise the system will COLLAPSE.

Age Average Net Worth. This is absolutely fucked.
18-24 $112,104
25-29 $120,183
30-34 $258,075
35-39 $501,295
40-44 $590,710
45-49 $781,936
50-54 $1,132,497
55-59 $1,441,987
60-64 $1,675,294
65-69 $1,836,884
70-74 $1,714,085
75-79 $1,629,275
80+ $1,611,984