Car Talk 6: Best of times and Worst of Times

[D Griff]

I will admit that the front on the new Model 3 is less uggo.

[golftdibrad1]

[max225]

Yea I don't think anyone is going to read/listen to any of it... They'll see EV and proceeded to shit all over it because reasons.

Camisa specifically said that 0-60 is irrelevant as is the HP # as of late... given the super high EV performance figures for those.

You of all people who have owned multiple Tessies and an M3 said yourself it's not really a comparison?

The M3 has noises, a manual, sensations, actually looks cool, no epic depreciation, history, C&C cred...

I dunno. Tesla is a better commuter. M3 is a better everything else.

I have not driven a relatively light Model 3 performance.. which is 1700lbs lighter than both of my EVs (X and IX)... and 700lbs lighter than the model S I had... weight is a major issue with EVs and model 3P is quite light.

[Desertbreh]

Yea I don't think anyone is going to read/listen to any of it... They'll see EV and proceeded to shit all over it because reasons.

Camisa specifically said that 0-60 is irrelevant as is the HP # as of late... given the super high EV performance figures for those.

You of all people who have owned multiple Tessies and an M3 said yourself it's not really a comparison?

The M3 has noises, a manual, sensations, actually looks cool, no epic depreciation, history, C&C cred...

I dunno. Tesla is a better commuter. M3 is a better everything else.

AND the fact that if you care for it in non-northeast climate it will still function perfectly in 10 years. No 20K battery etc. That said, I DO think it is cool that Tesla is making a good handling, good braking, fast AF Model 3 for pretty dang cheap and if I was a rooftop solar (I am) 100 mile a day commuter (I'm not) this thing would accomplish the goal of saving me a shitload of $$ on gas while simultaeously sparing me from killing myself. That is a noble accomplishment.

[D Griff]

You of all people who have owned multiple Tessies and an M3 said yourself it's not really a comparison?

The M3 has noises, a manual, sensations, actually looks cool, no epic depreciation, history, C&C cred...

I dunno. Tesla is a better commuter. M3 is a better everything else.

AND the fact that if you care for it in non-northeast climate it will still function perfectly in 10 years. No 20K battery etc. That said, I DO think it is cool that Tesla is making a good handling, good braking, fast AF Model 3 for pretty dang cheap and if I was a rooftop solar (I am) 100 mile a day commuter (I'm not) this thing would accomplish the goal of saving me a shitload of $$ on gas while simultaeously sparing me from killing myself. That is a noble accomplishment.

The job I interviewed for recently but turned down would've involved driving all over the state every week in my own vehicle and getting paid $0.6/mile to do that. Model 3P would probably be epic for that... but I think I'd still rather just drive an 86

[max225]

Theoretically speaking... outside of the "noises" what makes an M3 superior.. they are the same size and weight. And arguably the Tesla has far better weight distribution and weight balance for a "sport" sedan, so in theory it is dynamically superior.

And it doesn't come with BMW maintenance costs. with the whole battery thing... the BMW will need far more maintenance dollars to reach 100k miles and 8 years than the tesla any time of day, even when the battery cost is factored in. That's just a

I mean from a money argument the Tesla is a clear winner hands down. But it seems to be there from a handling and performance argument as well... Would love to see the two on a track... even though but it would be interesting.

The model 3P is lacking I would argue in some interior materials + perhaps exterior styling. But most "hate" the new G gen M3 anyways... so both the Tesla and the G///M are not generally considered lookers, so I would say perhaps it is even a moot point...

The sound... and the possibility of the are the two explainable differences between the two cars IMO.

[CaleDeRoo]

The Tesla is an absolute no go for me at any price because of the interior design.

[max225]

The Tesla is an absolute no go for me at any price because of the interior design.

The single screen minimalism bs?

[CaleDeRoo]

The Tesla is an absolute no go for me at any price because of the interior design.

The single screen minimalism bs?

Yes. Regardless of people saying you get used to the control layout, I just find it heinous looking. It looks like it could be a shared desk at a WeWork or something.

[max225]

The single screen minimalism bs?

Yes. Regardless of people saying you get used to the control layout, I just find it heinous looking.

Yea... the singular screen is not my favorite either. I can say that the center screen and tesla UI as a counter point... is superior to any other car infotainment. It is incredibly intuitive, easy to use.

I was literally thinking yesterday... M3 or Model 3... and the decision somewhat turned into the model 3 favor in my mind... However... Civic Type R somewhat remains... it is just about the same price as the model 3 performance... and likely cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle... at the expense of honda downrent interiors and lack of straight line performance and comfort.

[Desertbreh]

Yes. Regardless of people saying you get used to the control layout, I just find it heinous looking.

Yea... the singular screen is not my favorite either. I can say that the center screen and tesla UI as a counter point... is superior to any other car infotainment. It is incredibly intuitive, easy to use.

I was literally thinking yesterday... M3 or Model 3... and the decision somewhat turned into the model 3 favor in my mind... However... Civic Type R somewhat remains... it is just about the same price as the model 3 performance... and likely cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle... at the expense of honda downrent interiors and lack of straight line performance and comfort.

Then you would have two electric cars and no gasser. Fuck that.

[max225]

Yea... the singular screen is not my favorite either. I can say that the center screen and tesla UI as a counter point... is superior to any other car infotainment. It is incredibly intuitive, easy to use.

I was literally thinking yesterday... M3 or Model 3... and the decision somewhat turned into the model 3 favor in my mind... However... Civic Type R somewhat remains... it is just about the same price as the model 3 performance... and likely cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle... at the expense of honda downrent interiors and lack of straight line performance and comfort.

Then you would have two electric cars and no gasser. Fuck that.

Just tossing shit at the wall here... no decisions have been made. Was trying to see opinions outside of "EVs SUCK DIESEL RULES" here.

[Desertbreh]

Then you would have two electric cars and no gasser. Fuck that.

Just tossing shit at the wall here... no decisions have been made. Was trying to see opinions outside of "EVs SUCK DIESEL RULES" here.

[MexicanYarisTK]

The BEATR has finally left me stranded. I believe it sucked air into the clutch fluid since the pedal just sucks itself to the floor.

Same thing happened with my mk6 gti, but I'd fault myself for it since it was a praised cheap mod per forum breh's. Just an easy fix

[max225]

The BEATR has finally left me stranded. I believe it sucked air into the clutch fluid since the pedal just sucks itself to the floor.

How did suck air into the clutch fluid? This seems really weird.

[MexicanYarisTK]

Then you would have two electric cars and no gasser. Fuck that.

Just tossing shit at the wall here... no decisions have been made. Was trying to see opinions outside of "EVs SUCK DIESEL RULES" here.

Per my commute in the nations capital. Also when I rented a polestar 2.

Ev's are best in the city,
gas and diesel is great on highway/longer trips or commutes/country/etc.,
Plug in hybrid or hybrid are best in both worlds if for myself who has recently done a 6 mile commute one way in the city where i can legally go 45 mph at best, and also good at going outskirts/suburbs of the city for fun weekend shit. Diesel is ofc for long commute and they're quite fun with torque delivery, especially when i drove some overseas in Erdoganland

I mean granted, regardless of scenarios, ev's are best owned when you can charge it at home. I don't have that luxury, but i do however have a level 2 charger less than half a mile at my nearest strip mall that i can easily walk to and leave it for 8 hours when im sleeping a few times a week, that is if i just commute and not do much else driving wise during the work week.

[MexicanYarisTK]

The BEATR has finally left me stranded. I believe it sucked air into the clutch fluid since the pedal just sucks itself to the floor.

How did suck air into the clutch fluid? This seems really weird.

My guess is the bleeder hose or bleeder block gotten loose and caused a leak with fluid. Atleast with my experience

[D Griff]

Then you would have two electric cars and no gasser. Fuck that.

Just tossing shit at the wall here... no decisions have been made. Was trying to see opinions outside of "EVs SUCK DIESEL RULES" here.

We can't help it we live in flyover country, bro!

I'd be pretty open to one EV in the house, I'd be curious to try one, but I don't really want one and I don't think my wife does either, so not happening. I actually think a Civic interior is far nicer than a Tesla interior, but that's fairly subjective.

Also, I think EVs are like phones, they will depreciate to ZERO. A Hype R will be $40K in 10 years still. Granted $40K will be like a dinner at a steakhouse for six, but still. The Tessie will be worth a used piece of gum.

All that said, your points are not wrong. Teslas objectively make a ton of sense. They just don't really have any of the fizz. They are the most appliancy car brand on the market to me. It's like a girl that has an awesome job making good money, a normal stable family, her own interests in hobbies (that maybe even are cool), a great personality... but just is still ugly. The heart wants what it wants and a Tessie AIN'T it for me.

I personally wouldn't pay M3 money for a new M3 either, but it's certainly closer to the realm of possibility for me.

[CaleDeRoo]

The BEATR has finally left me stranded. I believe it sucked air into the clutch fluid since the pedal just sucks itself to the floor.

How did suck air into the clutch fluid? This seems really weird.

There could be a crack somewhere it's all 20+ years old. That's just my best case scenario. It's more likely the slave gave out. So not anything outrageous for an old high mileage car, but from first sign of a soft pedal leaving work to about 80% of the way home really left me no chance to diagnose it myself.

[max225]

Just tossing shit at the wall here... no decisions have been made. Was trying to see opinions outside of "EVs SUCK DIESEL RULES" here.

We can't help it we live in flyover country, bro!

I'd be pretty open to one EV in the house, I'd be curious to try one, but I don't really want one and I don't think my wife does either, so not happening. I actually think a Civic interior is far nicer than a Tesla interior, but that's fairly subjective.

Also, I think EVs are like phones, they will depreciate to ZERO. A Hype R will be $40K in 10 years still. Granted $40K will be like a dinner at a steakhouse for six, but still. The Tessie will be worth a used piece of gum.

All that said, your points are not wrong. Teslas objectively make a ton of sense. They just don't really have any of the fizz. They are the most appliancy car brand on the market to me. It's like a girl that has an awesome job making good money, a normal stable family, her own interests in hobbies (that maybe even are cool), a great personality... but just is still ugly. The heart wants what it wants and a Tessie AIN'T it for me.

I personally wouldn't pay M3 money for a new M3 either, but it's certainly closer to the realm of possibility for me.

I will never argue for some sort of style points or individuality in a tesla. Where clearly it is the worst of the bunch... especially where I live (pic incoming).

That said I was legitimately trying to debate the pros and cons of either.
I have a fancy BMW EV now... what are my issues with it?
1. Weight 5700lbs is insane
2. Cost 96k is insane
3. Complexity 4k windshields can suck a dick

That said... The model 3 performance... fixes all 3... and supposedly is FUN also. My current ev is "fun" in some regards... 520hp is nothing to sneeze at... but the weight makes it wallwoy and difficult to drive fast IMO.But the weight down low is difficult to quantify but it is a significant advantage.. My 1200lbs lighter tacoma is abysmal through the turns and leans... and EV just doesn't. They have a solidity to them that is second to note. A modern m3 is pretty porky at 4k lbs... so I was curious about the obvious compare... the other less obvious compare is a Type R... at a feathery light 3200lbs... and a 30k discount over the M3 it must be quite fun to drive... + the epic honderp shifter.... Probs my top 3 new performance cars on my mind at the moment.

[max225]

Work today

[D Griff]

We can't help it we live in flyover country, bro!

I'd be pretty open to one EV in the house, I'd be curious to try one, but I don't really want one and I don't think my wife does either, so not happening. I actually think a Civic interior is far nicer than a Tesla interior, but that's fairly subjective.

Also, I think EVs are like phones, they will depreciate to ZERO. A Hype R will be $40K in 10 years still. Granted $40K will be like a dinner at a steakhouse for six, but still. The Tessie will be worth a used piece of gum.

All that said, your points are not wrong. Teslas objectively make a ton of sense. They just don't really have any of the fizz. They are the most appliancy car brand on the market to me. It's like a girl that has an awesome job making good money, a normal stable family, her own interests in hobbies (that maybe even are cool), a great personality... but just is still ugly. The heart wants what it wants and a Tessie AIN'T it for me.

I personally wouldn't pay M3 money for a new M3 either, but it's certainly closer to the realm of possibility for me.

I will never argue for some sort of style points or individuality in a tesla. Where clearly it is the worst of the bunch... especially where I live (pic incoming).

That said I was legitimately trying to debate the pros and cons of either.
I have a fancy BMW EV now... what are my issues with it?
1. Weight 5700lbs is insane
2. Cost 96k is insane
3. Complexity 4k windshields can suck a dick

That said... The model 3 performance... fixes all 3... and supposedly is FUN also. My current ev is "fun" in some regards... 520hp is nothing to sneeze at... but the weight makes it wallwoy and difficult to drive fast IMO.But the weight down low is difficult to quantify but it is a significant advantage.. My 1200lbs lighter tacoma is abysmal through the turns and leans... and EV just doesn't. They have a solidity to them that is second to note. A modern m3 is pretty porky at 4k lbs... so I was curious about the obvious compare... the other less obvious compare is a Type R... at a feathery light 3200lbs... and a 30k discount over the M3 it must be quite fun to drive... + the epic honderp shifter.... Probs my top 3 new performance cars on my mind at the moment.

Sure, I’m just saying the fizz isn’t really quantifiable. The R gives me more of it than the other two you’re thinking about but it’s objectively worse. Looks are 100% part of what I like about cars, I want that thing I turn around and look back at and feel cool driving.

And I know I’m about the manual thing, but I stand by it for me personally. Driving around in a city/suburban area isn’t ‘fun’ but a manual makes it more entertaining to me. On a track I could give two shits about a manual but in regular driving, it adds to the enjoyment.

[SAWCE]

I will never argue for some sort of style points or individuality in a tesla. Where clearly it is the worst of the bunch... especially where I live (pic incoming).

That said I was legitimately trying to debate the pros and cons of either.
I have a fancy BMW EV now... what are my issues with it?
1. Weight 5700lbs is insane
2. Cost 96k is insane
3. Complexity 4k windshields can suck a dick

That said... The model 3 performance... fixes all 3... and supposedly is FUN also. My current ev is "fun" in some regards... 520hp is nothing to sneeze at... but the weight makes it wallwoy and difficult to drive fast IMO.But the weight down low is difficult to quantify but it is a significant advantage.. My 1200lbs lighter tacoma is abysmal through the turns and leans... and EV just doesn't. They have a solidity to them that is second to note. A modern m3 is pretty porky at 4k lbs... so I was curious about the obvious compare... the other less obvious compare is a Type R... at a feathery light 3200lbs... and a 30k discount over the M3 it must be quite fun to drive... + the epic honderp shifter.... Probs my top 3 new performance cars on my mind at the moment.

Sure, I’m just saying the fizz isn’t really quantifiable. The R gives me more of it than the other two you’re thinking about but it’s objectively worse. Looks are 100% part of what I like about cars, I want that thing I turn around and look back at and feel cool driving.

And I know I’m about the manual thing, but I stand by it for me personally. Driving around in a city/suburban area isn’t ‘fun’ but a manual makes it more entertaining to me. On a track I could give two shits about a manual but in regular driving, it adds to the enjoyment.

Looks and a manual are big on my list. I’ve been hard parking the Mini most places and I crack a smile when I walk up and see it. The tiny form factor, the little driving lamps sticking off the grille.. it’s got the fizz and makes me feel fizzy inside.

[Tar]

Oof... the memes are getting too personal, glad they're leaving hybrid owners alone for now LOL

[wap]

Yeah, mang. Maybe it was his wife's car? He also own(ed?) an old '89 Bronco, so...
But he definitely has some cool car cred.
https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/lifestyle ... collection

That bronco II kinda slaps! Needs a different color but I fux with it. How hipster of him to get the bronco II.

Also must have a full time mechanic for his Austin Healy.

No doubt! And for the Astons too, probably.