Car Talk 6: Best of times and Worst of Times

[MexicanYarisTK]

Part of my trip was some Nurburgring Norschlife laps (car will remain unnamed for now but it was pretty embarrassing). I have to say, I haven't been a 'Porsche guy' at all but man, now the wants are quite real.

It can't be embarrassing as my clio as i kinda see it like my fwd miata

[MexicanYarisTK]

You're comparing the world renouned street/track event to which part part of the US though? It really depend too, I have never been to the "Ring" but some videos also show a lot of older Peugeots, VWs, BMWs etc. IMO track days with a shit box make sense. But I am a peasant.

And agreed on the boxster/cayman. But the issue is now... there is no such thing as a "cheapest" six cylinder Boxster/cayman, unless you go to the GT"insert number/letter here" Porsche basically removed the sub 6 figure vehicles for the "every man". Now you get a subaru-esque 2.slow or 2.5 turbo 4...

Porsche IMO has a huge appeal because no matter what you choose, unless you go stupid with options, you get a high quality vehicle that will likely last many years without issue, and is a ton of "usable" fun. I don't really see the point of a 700hp corvette or whatever. A 350-450hp porsche is just as fun as long as it sounds good... and it doesn't come with the corvette stigma.

However the issue now with everything being turBRO most don't sound good. So that's the main caveat along with the pricing.

These were 'tourist laps' AKA pay 30 Euro and get out there in whatever the hell you have... on a random week night. There were a handful of Miatas, Hondas, older BMWs but over 50% of the cars were Porsches.

I've kind of done the gambit of track stuff here from DC to Atlanta, plenty of wealthy areas in there and I've lapped with a number of different orgs. Sure, you get the occasional older Porsche or once in a while, a rich dude in something but it is definitely not the norm.

I rented a 'Mini Cooper' and got a Fiat 500. The only other options from Sixt at pickup were basic 320/420i, I figured a slow car fast with would be more fun than a pedestrian three series. I was very much alone on the Ring in a slow car.

I would've just gone for the bimmers if i were you, i rented a 1 series on my last visit but didnt do the ring.

On another note, wants to go to Gatlinburg so I may subject to go in November so I can at the tail of the dragon, of course the city is dope too, the accommodation I have found was unique, so I thought that would be the experience as well. We're planning to roadtrip, cause i found flights to be absurd price wise than i was expecting. But I don't wanna do it with the accord as i feel it is kinda boaty and nose heavy. It did alright on blue ridge, but my gti would have done better as she did on skyline drive. I was thinking get a 3 or 5 series off sixt if i were to roadtrip

[golftdibrad1]

These were 'tourist laps' AKA pay 30 Euro and get out there in whatever the hell you have... on a random week night. There were a handful of Miatas, Hondas, older BMWs but over 50% of the cars were Porsches.

I've kind of done the gambit of track stuff here from DC to Atlanta, plenty of wealthy areas in there and I've lapped with a number of different orgs. Sure, you get the occasional older Porsche or once in a while, a rich dude in something but it is definitely not the norm.

I rented a 'Mini Cooper' and got a Fiat 500. The only other options from Sixt at pickup were basic 320/420i, I figured a slow car fast with would be more fun than a pedestrian three series. I was very much alone on the Ring in a slow car.

I would've just gone for the bimmers if i were you, i rented a 1 series on my last visit but didnt do the ring.

On another note, wants to go to Gatlinburg so I may subject to go in November so I can at the tail of the dragon, of course the city is dope too, the accommodation I have found was unique, so I thought that would be the experience as well. We're planning to roadtrip, cause i found flights to be absurd price wise than i was expecting. But I don't wanna do it with the accord as i feel it is kinda boaty and nose heavy. It did alright on blue ridge, but my gti would have done better as she did on skyline drive. I was thinking get a 3 or 5 series off sixt if i were to roadtrip

A three series on TOTD is great. Well, anything is great really. November is the 'off season' so its usually not too crowded up there. Lots of other roads too if you want to do a day of driving. G-burg to TOTD is about 2 hours be warned tho. But aside from parkway and the roads in the GSMNP, none of the roads suck.

[MexicanYarisTK]

Yea the other thing to keep in mind. Cars in Europe a luxury. Whereas cars in the US are necessity. And then once you get to the upper echelon of car related activities such as the nord-Schleife it certainly keeps the crap out.

in Turkey, when my 1.3t 130 hp clio got serviced when my dad took it in, the advisor asked if he was gonna sell it anytime soon, cause they stopped making 1.3t for them. People go crazy for those

[D Griff]

They are half the price. End of the day, you get what you pay for. The Corvette offers performance of cars 2-4x it’s price point and solid long term reliability. You have to pay for that somewhere and it’s mostly things like interior, a bit of build quality. I’m really glad Corvettes exist because they mean normal people like us (collective of this forum) can have a taste of that performance level. Look how many on here have owned a Corvette, like half the forum?

They can be “half the price”. Porsche obviously has that whole option you to death model … but a cayman isn’t that much more than a corvette if at all unless you go to the special models …

It’s hard to draw apples to apples compare though given the diversity within the P car line up

Well, sure, but that Cayman offers WAY less performance than a C8. Lap time for lap time a Corvette is half price pretty much and also way cheaper to run. I'm not saying the Corvette is better or worse or anything, just that it is alone in its space of a poor man's super car and it does that job really well. There are sacrifices made to get there.

[D Griff]

I'm familiar with that. I guess even if the recall is free I won't have to worry about getting my car on and off a flat bed with a locked column.

Yep, I installed that thing in the first month or two of ownershit, from what I recall you don't have to take too much apart, easier than fucking with towing.

[max225]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

[D Griff]

Part of my trip was some Nurburgring Norschlife laps (car will remain unnamed for now but it was pretty embarrassing). I have to say, I haven't been a 'Porsche guy' at all but man, now the wants are quite real.

It can't be embarrassing as my clio as i kinda see it like my fwd miata

Your Clio has 2X the powah This was a 70HP shitbox. It was pretty fun though, I loved hooning the stupid thing on the Ring. It was just a little bit scary getting passed by Porsches going like 3X my speed on uphills. I actually hung with a Cayman GT4 for a pretty good ways through a section with a lot of corners and was pretty stoked on that. The driver obviously was a maximum noob but still,

[D Griff]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

I am honestly with you, I really don't covet a C8 other than sort of the Z06; I'd rather have a Coxster S manual... but it is a far inferior performance vehicle. They just fill different niches IMO, and I do think the Corvette nails it for its mission.

I obviously own a slow AF car, my priorities lie with inputs as far as driving dynamics go.

[D Griff]

I would've just gone for the bimmers if i were you, i rented a 1 series on my last visit but didnt do the ring.

On another note, wants to go to Gatlinburg so I may subject to go in November so I can at the tail of the dragon, of course the city is dope too, the accommodation I have found was unique, so I thought that would be the experience as well. We're planning to roadtrip, cause i found flights to be absurd price wise than i was expecting. But I don't wanna do it with the accord as i feel it is kinda boaty and nose heavy. It did alright on blue ridge, but my gti would have done better as she did on skyline drive. I was thinking get a 3 or 5 series off sixt if i were to roadtrip

A three series on TOTD is great. Well, anything is great really. November is the 'off season' so its usually not too crowded up there. Lots of other roads too if you want to do a day of driving. G-burg to TOTD is about 2 hours be warned tho. But aside from parkway and the roads in the GSMNP, none of the roads suck.

The parkway sucks?

[max225]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

I am honestly with you, I really don't covet a C8 other than sort of the Z06; I'd rather have a Coxster S manual... but it is a far inferior performance vehicle. They just fill different niches IMO, and I do think the Corvette nails it for its mission.

I obviously own a slow AF car, my priorities lie with inputs as far as driving dynamics go.

[golftdibrad1]

A three series on TOTD is great. Well, anything is great really. November is the 'off season' so its usually not too crowded up there. Lots of other roads too if you want to do a day of driving. G-burg to TOTD is about 2 hours be warned tho. But aside from parkway and the roads in the GSMNP, none of the roads suck.

The parkway sucks?

From gatlinburg, IE parkway drive in Pigeon Forge. FOOTHILLS parkway does not suck...even though it is technically part of GSMNP...but whatever.

[D Griff]

The parkway sucks?

From gatlinburg, IE parkway drive in Pigeon Forge. FOOTHILLS parkway does not suck...even though it is technically part of GSMNP...but whatever.

Gotcha, I was thinking Foothills or Blueridge which are both epic. BRP is obviously not a fast driving road by any means, but man, those views though. I've been going my entire life and it doesn't disappoint.

[golftdibrad1]

From gatlinburg, IE parkway drive in Pigeon Forge. FOOTHILLS parkway does not suck...even though it is technically part of GSMNP...but whatever.

Gotcha, I was thinking Foothills or Blueridge which are both epic. BRP is obviously not a fast driving road by any means, but man, those views though. I've been going my entire life and it doesn't disappoint.

Yea I did part of it on my motorcycle last weekend and it was amazing as usual. Already chilly up there

[Desertbreh]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

My inner mulletman wants a LOT of Mustangs. A Mach 1 in the grey drove by me yesterday. It was pretty bad ass. https://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/2023/models/mach-1/.
And I would rather drive any GT Mustang than a BRZ. But that's because I'm trash.

[max225]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

My inner mulletman wants a LOT of Mustangs. A Mach 1 in the grey drove by me yesterday. It was pretty bad ass. https://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/2023/models/mach-1/.
And I would rather drive any GT Mustang than a BRZ. But that's because I'm trash.

Yea but that's nearly double the price so not really a fair comparison... you can easily build a Poorsche for 80-90 and it neatly overlaps with the Corvette 2LT.

[CaleDeRoo]

Couldn’t quote

Don’t disagree but lap times aren’t everything. You arguably buy a far better quality/brand/visual vehicle that is slower. But does it make it less fun ?

To me it’s like mustang vs brz. Yes the mustang is faster but who gives a F

My inner mulletman wants a LOT of Mustangs. A Mach 1 in the grey drove by me yesterday. It was pretty bad ass. https://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/2023/models/mach-1/.
And I would rather drive any GT Mustang than a BRZ. But that's because I'm trash.

The mach 1 in purple or green is fucking SEXY.

[Desertbreh]

My inner mulletman wants a LOT of Mustangs. A Mach 1 in the grey drove by me yesterday. It was pretty bad ass. https://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/2023/models/mach-1/.
And I would rather drive any GT Mustang than a BRZ. But that's because I'm trash.

The mach 1 in purple or green is fucking SEXY.

The green is hot.

[MexicanYarisTK]

It can't be embarrassing as my clio as i kinda see it like my fwd miata

Your Clio has 2X the powah This was a 70HP shitbox. It was pretty fun though, I loved hooning the stupid thing on the Ring. It was just a little bit scary getting passed by Porsches going like 3X my speed on uphills. I actually hung with a Cayman GT4 for a pretty good ways through a section with a lot of corners and was pretty stoked on that. The driver obviously was a maximum noob but still,

Thats still pretty good that you kept up with a gt4 with lack of driver mods, proof that driver matters more than power on the track. Straight aways are too easy.

Also 500's feel a little bit tallish. I rode in a back seat of a 500 in Turkey once, on the highway it was not fun as it was my friends sister who was driving and driving roughly 40 mph. Kinda reminds of the girl on clueless learning how to drive in the red e36 vert

[D Griff]

Your Clio has 2X the powah This was a 70HP shitbox. It was pretty fun though, I loved hooning the stupid thing on the Ring. It was just a little bit scary getting passed by Porsches going like 3X my speed on uphills. I actually hung with a Cayman GT4 for a pretty good ways through a section with a lot of corners and was pretty stoked on that. The driver obviously was a maximum noob but still,

Thats still pretty good that you kept up with a gt4 with lack of driver mods, proof that driver matters more than power on the track. Straight aways are too easy.

Also 500's feel a little bit tallish. I rode in a back seat of a 500 in Turkey once, on the highway it was not fun as it was my friends sister who was driving and driving roughly 40 mph. Kinda reminds of the girl on clueless learning how to drive in the red e36 vert

150 other Porsches blew by me in the straights and corners every lap But I was in heaven for a couple minutes chasing that thing down in the shitbox.

500 definitely feels tall, the ergonomics in that thing are so trash, even my wife was like 'why am I sitting so high up in this tiny car'.

We stopped over in Iceland on the way home for 48 hours (flights were shorter/cheaper that way and Iceland is :chefkiss: ) and rented a Toyota Aygo. All in all I preferred the five hunnit but the ergo of the Aygo was vastly superior

[D Griff]

I also like a Mustang but not quite enough to buy one unless it was a GT350.

[max225]

Is that eruption green ? It’s one of my fav fraud colors …

[coogles]

I also like a Mustang but not quite enough to buy one unless it was a GT350.

I think I'd miss the lightness and size of the 86 now that I'm used to it, but a flat plane crank would give me enough of a to get over it.

[CaleDeRoo]

Is that eruption green ? It’s one of my fav fraud colors …

Yep it is

[Johnny_P]

I also like a Mustang but not quite enough to buy one unless it was a GT350.

Mustangs are still cool. The new one, V8 with the 10 speed should be pretty dope. The Camaro SS I rented with the V8 and 10 speed was wild. Transmission was absolutely perfect and the thing was fast as hell.

The again my dads truck has the 5.0 with that transmission and it’s terrible :fraud: