Car talk tré: Carpocalypse Now!

Brothers of brub and brap, this is your safe space.
User avatar
CorvetteWaxer
Senior Master Sirloin
Senior Master Sirloin
Posts: 8381
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:35 pm
Drives: 1986 Hyundai Excel, 351C swap
Location: Where it happens every year

Desertbreh wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:22 pm
CorvetteWaxer wrote: Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:30 pm Got itImage
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
Congratulations on this dood. Beautiful. It was time.

I now have the newest Corvette on the forum, LOL.
Thanks man! :like: :like:
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:07 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:05 pm

Sometimes you have some much money you don’t care. You accept it as a cost of entry
That's when you say fuck Porsche and buy a McLaren in every color so that you can always have one to drive while the rest are in the shop.
I can tell you first hand i’d buy a GT2RS at $420k over a 720S at the same price in a heartbeat.

The McLaren is fragile, will spend months at a time in the shop, and just doesn’t have the same “heft” to it.

With all the pedigree and engineering in the 911, you can drive it to the track, slay lap after lap after lap and drive it at 10/10ths, and drive back... the only way you break a GT car is by crashing it.

With the massive growth McLaren is going through, it’s been troubling for quality. They’re delivered broken or incomplete, take weeks to get the correct parts as they’re hand built and not off the shelf... but the biggest problem I personally see is that each car feels like it’s just a test mule for the next model when a boutique car company announces there’s going to be 15 new models in 6 years.

A Porsche is a refinement and an evolution of its replacement. McLaren unfortunately just doesn’t have that pedigree yet.
User avatar
max225
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Posts: 42435
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:49 am
Drives: Taco+ Bavarian lemon

fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:09 pm
troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:07 pm

That's when you say fuck Porsche and buy a McLaren in every color so that you can always have one to drive while the rest are in the shop.
I can tell you first hand i’d buy a GT2RS at $420k over a 720S at the same price in a heartbeat.

The McLaren is fragile, will spend months at a time in the shop, and just doesn’t have the same “heft” to it.

With all the pedigree and engineering in the 911, you can drive it to the track, slay lap after lap after lap and drive it at 10/10ths, and drive back... the only way you break a GT car is by crashing it.

With the massive growth McLaren is going through, it’s been troubling for quality. They’re delivered broken or incomplete, take weeks to get the correct parts as they’re hand built and not off the shelf... but the biggest problem I personally see is that each car feels like it’s just a test mule for the next model when a boutique car company announces there’s going to be 15 new models in 6 years.

A Porsche is a refinement and an evolution of its replacement. McLaren unfortunately just doesn’t have that pedigree yet.
I thought the vast majority of McChicken issues were with their first model... MP4-12C which seems to be absolute garbage, the subsequent model seem to be better... with the 570s punching way above it's weight class.

Then again buying McLarens is supporting Saudi terrorists... :disgust:
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:05 pm
CorvetteWaxer wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:04 pm

Same thing, except the extra zeros and the fact that you could just buy some rental apartments in Oakland and make section 8 money forever on them...

I dunno.. Even if I hit the powerball and had $200M in my account I don't think I could bring myself to pay that markup. I'd find another dealer or car to buy.
Sometimes you have some much money you don’t care. You accept it as a cost of entry
This is where Porsche is going with it’s upper echelon models. Average household income of a Porsche client is around $550k, ahead of second place Jaguar around $220 k and Benz around $110. That number has recently gone down because of the 4 cylinder Macan.

Porsche are getting wise to the resale/desirability of the halo cars, and getting in on the game. If the money is there for it, why not supply the demand?

We currently get $80k over MSRP on a GT3RS and $160k on a GT2RS. It’s the market, and we can get it.
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:15 pm
fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:09 pm

I can tell you first hand i’d buy a GT2RS at $420k over a 720S at the same price in a heartbeat.

The McLaren is fragile, will spend months at a time in the shop, and just doesn’t have the same “heft” to it.

With all the pedigree and engineering in the 911, you can drive it to the track, slay lap after lap after lap and drive it at 10/10ths, and drive back... the only way you break a GT car is by crashing it.

With the massive growth McLaren is going through, it’s been troubling for quality. They’re delivered broken or incomplete, take weeks to get the correct parts as they’re hand built and not off the shelf... but the biggest problem I personally see is that each car feels like it’s just a test mule for the next model when a boutique car company announces there’s going to be 15 new models in 6 years.

A Porsche is a refinement and an evolution of its replacement. McLaren unfortunately just doesn’t have that pedigree yet.
I thought the vast majority of McChicken issues were with their first model... MP4-12C which seems to be absolute garbage, the subsequent model seem to be better... with the 570s punching way above it's weight class.

Then again buying McLarens is supporting Saudi terrorists... :disgust:
I have seen a 720 delivered off the transport that we have had to replace a dashboard and front fender on that came loose on the boat. We had a 675 LT Spider arrive with the wrong color interior and an A pillar trim missing entirely.

They are engineering marvels and phenomenal performers. I feel they’re built too much like F1 cars and worry about longevity like a 80s-90s lotus or lambo.
User avatar
max225
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Posts: 42435
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:49 am
Drives: Taco+ Bavarian lemon

fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:22 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:15 pm

I thought the vast majority of McChicken issues were with their first model... MP4-12C which seems to be absolute garbage, the subsequent model seem to be better... with the 570s punching way above it's weight class.

Then again buying McLarens is supporting Saudi terrorists... :disgust:
I have seen a 720 delivered off the transport that we have had to replace a dashboard and front fender on that came loose on the boat. We had a 675 LT Spider arrive with the wrong color interior and an A pillar trim missing entirely.

They are engineering marvels and phenomenal performers. I feel they’re built too much like F1 cars and worry about longevity like a 80s-90s lotus or lambo.
:disgust:
User avatar
CorvetteWaxer
Senior Master Sirloin
Senior Master Sirloin
Posts: 8381
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:35 pm
Drives: 1986 Hyundai Excel, 351C swap
Location: Where it happens every year

fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:17 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:05 pm

Sometimes you have some much money you don’t care. You accept it as a cost of entry
This is where Porsche is going with it’s upper echelon models. Average household income of a Porsche client is around $550k, ahead of second place Jaguar around $220 k and Benz around $110. That number has recently gone down because of the 4 cylinder Macan.

Porsche are getting wise to the resale/desirability of the halo cars, and getting in on the game. If the money is there for it, why not supply the demand?

We currently get $80k over MSRP on a GT3RS and $160k on a GT2RS. It’s the market, and we can get it.
True.

The crazy thing is that the production numbers going around for 911's tho... Roughly 40% of the 911's built last year were GT cars, so they are not rare at all. So many guys are trying hard to unload their GT3's on Rennlist now, realizing they can't flip them for a profit. The only ones that are going to buy a GT3 for over at a dealer are the ones that haven't looked and are running on old info that they are "impossible" to get. The C4S is a much more rare car than the GT cars!

The RS cars are still in high demand, but I think that will change a bit in the next few months as there are a lot of guys trying to sell their allocations that are set to arrive in the USA in/around May. With cars coming in that late in the year with the model change, I can only guess that there are a lot of cars still waiting to get on a boat to come to the dealers.
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

CorvetteWaxer wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:24 pm
fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:17 pm

This is where Porsche is going with it’s upper echelon models. Average household income of a Porsche client is around $550k, ahead of second place Jaguar around $220 k and Benz around $110. That number has recently gone down because of the 4 cylinder Macan.

Porsche are getting wise to the resale/desirability of the halo cars, and getting in on the game. If the money is there for it, why not supply the demand?

We currently get $80k over MSRP on a GT3RS and $160k on a GT2RS. It’s the market, and we can get it.
True.

The crazy thing is that the production numbers going around for 911's tho... Roughly 40% of the 911's built last year were GT cars, so they are not rare at all. So many guys are trying hard to unload their GT3's on Rennlist now, realizing they can't flip them for a profit. The only ones that are going to buy a GT3 for over at a dealer are the ones that haven't looked and are running on old info that they are "impossible" to get. The C4S is a much more rare car than the GT cars!

The RS cars are still in high demand, but I think that will change a bit in the next few months as there are a lot of guys trying to sell their allocations that are set to arrive in the USA in/around May. With cars coming in that late in the year with the model change, I can only guess that there are a lot of cars still waiting to get on a boat to come to the dealers.
You’re looking at the new GT3 coming in late 2020 and an RS in 2021 at the earliest right now. These are the last new GT cars coming for a while, so values will hold very well.

I’ve easily got a dozen more GT cars coming. I have 5 GT2’s in inventory.

Your GTS is in a similar boat which is why I thought a GT Silver PDK car is a massively resale friendly car for you to jump into. GTS models are typically the last series models to arrive. A 992 GTS is a long way away.
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:23 pm
fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:22 pm

I have seen a 720 delivered off the transport that we have had to replace a dashboard and front fender on that came loose on the boat. We had a 675 LT Spider arrive with the wrong color interior and an A pillar trim missing entirely.

They are engineering marvels and phenomenal performers. I feel they’re built too much like F1 cars and worry about longevity like a 80s-90s lotus or lambo.
:disgust:
It’s kind of a bummer, in the “don’t meet your heroes” kind of way.
User avatar
max225
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Posts: 42435
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:49 am
Drives: Taco+ Bavarian lemon

fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:36 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:23 pm

:disgust:
It’s kind of a bummer, in the “don’t meet your heroes” kind of way.
They do have some kind of epic extended warranty deal... available... 4k a year i think... which is :notbad: for the price of the vehicle... but yea... having it constantly break and be out of commision will get old if it still happens.
User avatar
CorvetteWaxer
Senior Master Sirloin
Senior Master Sirloin
Posts: 8381
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:35 pm
Drives: 1986 Hyundai Excel, 351C swap
Location: Where it happens every year

fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:35 pm
CorvetteWaxer wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:24 pm

True.

The crazy thing is that the production numbers going around for 911's tho... Roughly 40% of the 911's built last year were GT cars, so they are not rare at all. So many guys are trying hard to unload their GT3's on Rennlist now, realizing they can't flip them for a profit. The only ones that are going to buy a GT3 for over at a dealer are the ones that haven't looked and are running on old info that they are "impossible" to get. The C4S is a much more rare car than the GT cars!

The RS cars are still in high demand, but I think that will change a bit in the next few months as there are a lot of guys trying to sell their allocations that are set to arrive in the USA in/around May. With cars coming in that late in the year with the model change, I can only guess that there are a lot of cars still waiting to get on a boat to come to the dealers.
You’re looking at the new GT3 coming in late 2020 and an RS in 2021 at the earliest right now. These are the last new GT cars coming for a while, so values will hold very well.

I’ve easily got a dozen more GT cars coming. I have 5 GT2’s in inventory.

Your GTS is in a similar boat which is why I thought a GT Silver PDK car is a massively resale friendly car for you to jump into. GTS models are typically the last series models to arrive. A 992 GTS is a long way away.
As I've said before, I really value your input and thank you for all the advice. Having someone on the inside to ease my concerns meant/means a lot.

You rock, dude!
User avatar
troyguitar
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Posts: 20088
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:15 pm
Drives: Trek Domane
Location: Swamp

fledonfoot wrote:
troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:07 pm That's when you say fuck Porsche and buy a McLaren in every color so that you can always have one to drive while the rest are in the shop.
I can tell you first hand i’d buy a GT2RS at $420k over a 720S at the same price in a heartbeat.

The McLaren is fragile, will spend months at a time in the shop, and just doesn’t have the same “heft” to it.

With all the pedigree and engineering in the 911, you can drive it to the track, slay lap after lap after lap and drive it at 10/10ths, and drive back... the only way you break a GT car is by crashing it.

With the massive growth McLaren is going through, it’s been troubling for quality. They’re delivered broken or incomplete, take weeks to get the correct parts as they’re hand built and not off the shelf... but the biggest problem I personally see is that each car feels like it’s just a test mule for the next model when a boutique car company announces there’s going to be 15 new models in 6 years.

A Porsche is a refinement and an evolution of its replacement. McLaren unfortunately just doesn’t have that pedigree yet.
I don't understand the point of any of these things. For that kind of money you can own an actual race car that will make any road car look like a Geo Metro... Maybe that's why I'm poor?
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:49 pm
fledonfoot wrote:
I can tell you first hand i’d buy a GT2RS at $420k over a 720S at the same price in a heartbeat.

The McLaren is fragile, will spend months at a time in the shop, and just doesn’t have the same “heft” to it.

With all the pedigree and engineering in the 911, you can drive it to the track, slay lap after lap after lap and drive it at 10/10ths, and drive back... the only way you break a GT car is by crashing it.

With the massive growth McLaren is going through, it’s been troubling for quality. They’re delivered broken or incomplete, take weeks to get the correct parts as they’re hand built and not off the shelf... but the biggest problem I personally see is that each car feels like it’s just a test mule for the next model when a boutique car company announces there’s going to be 15 new models in 6 years.

A Porsche is a refinement and an evolution of its replacement. McLaren unfortunately just doesn’t have that pedigree yet.
I don't understand the point of any of these things. For that kind of money you can own an actual race car that will make any road car look like a Geo Metro... Maybe that's why I'm poor?
Few of these cars are actually driven on the track. They’re status symbols and flipped from owner to owner.

You’ve owned race/track prepped cars and karts, right? You know that’s a whole other level of commitment. At least with a production series car you’ve got a dealer network, a warranty, and don’t have to hire your own support staff to keep it running.
User avatar
max225
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Posts: 42435
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:49 am
Drives: Taco+ Bavarian lemon

As I mentioned @Troy almost no one tracks these things. That's just their marketing ploy, just like the submariner rolex isn't worn by submariners.
User avatar
max225
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Chief Master Sirloin of the Wasteful Steak
Posts: 42435
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:49 am
Drives: Taco+ Bavarian lemon

[user not found] wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:06 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:04 pm As I mentioned @Troy almost no one tracks these things. That's just their marketing ploy, just like the submariner rolex isn't worn by submariners.
Maybe out in the pay area this is true, but out here there is a large culture of actually playing with your toys.
No better place to play than here. You can drive it to work, or to bang the mistresses hot friend 365 days a year. Unlike most places in the states.
User avatar
troyguitar
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Posts: 20088
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:15 pm
Drives: Trek Domane
Location: Swamp

fledonfoot wrote:
troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:49 pm I don't understand the point of any of these things. For that kind of money you can own an actual race car that will make any road car look like a Geo Metro... Maybe that's why I'm poor?
Few of these cars are actually driven on the track. They’re status symbols and flipped from owner to owner.

You’ve owned race/track prepped cars and karts, right? You know that’s a whole other level of commitment. At least with a production series car you’ve got a dealer network, a warranty, and don’t have to hire your own support staff to keep it running.
I know people who work in some vintage race car shops. The people who own the cars don't do anything but have their people pay the bills. The shop stores, maintains, and transports the cars. The owners get chauffeured from their jet to the track, do their "racing" and have their chauffeur take them back.

Driving your own car to the track and back is for poor people. Going to a dealer? How uncivilized!
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:41 pm
fledonfoot wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:36 pm

It’s kind of a bummer, in the “don’t meet your heroes” kind of way.
They do have some kind of epic extended warranty deal... available... 4k a year i think... which is :notbad: for the price of the vehicle... but yea... having it constantly break and be out of commision will get old if it still happens.
They do, you can CPO them for varying lengths depending on pocket depth.

I make them seem like they’re all unreliable, but I think it’s because I’m biased because I work on the service end and it comes out that way. I’m around broken cars all day and I’m trained to point it out to people. Hell, I’m at a point in my life where a McLaren F1 that was on my bedroom wall when I was a kid, and now I can go see three of them up close, engine out... and it’s just “normal”. While I love my job and where I work, it’s dulling the “special” feeling you get from seeing these amazing things up close and in detail.
User avatar
fledonfoot
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 4244
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Drives: Taco Truk | Power Wheels Heep

troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:10 pm
fledonfoot wrote:
Few of these cars are actually driven on the track. They’re status symbols and flipped from owner to owner.

You’ve owned race/track prepped cars and karts, right? You know that’s a whole other level of commitment. At least with a production series car you’ve got a dealer network, a warranty, and don’t have to hire your own support staff to keep it running.
I know people who work in some vintage race car shops. The people who own the cars don't do anything but have their people pay the bills. The shop stores, maintains, and transports the cars. The owners get chauffeured from their jet to the track, do their "racing" and have their chauffeur take them back.

Driving your own car to the track and back is for poor people. Going to a dealer? How uncivilized!
The delta from this kind of person to a GT3 owner is the same difference from a GT3 owner to a GTI owner like myself.
User avatar
troyguitar
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Posts: 20088
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:15 pm
Drives: Trek Domane
Location: Swamp

fledonfoot wrote:
troyguitar wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:10 pm I know people who work in some vintage race car shops. The people who own the cars don't do anything but have their people pay the bills. The shop stores, maintains, and transports the cars. The owners get chauffeured from their jet to the track, do their "racing" and have their chauffeur take them back.

Driving your own car to the track and back is for poor people. Going to a dealer? How uncivilized!
The delta from this kind of person to a GT3 owner is the same difference from a GT3 owner to a GTI owner like myself.
Could be. They're all so far beyond anything I could ever imagine that it's hard to see any difference. It's like Batman vs Spider-Man.
User avatar
4zilch
First Sirloin
First Sirloin
Posts: 6241
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:42 am
Drives: Ford Party ST
Location: God’s Country

[user not found] wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:06 pm
max225 wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:04 pm As I mentioned @Troy almost no one tracks these things. That's just their marketing ploy, just like the submariner rolex isn't worn by submariners.
Maybe out in the pay area this is true, but out here there is a large culture of actually playing with your toys.
:dat:

There’s at least enough to organize Porsche Club track days at various spots throughout the country
As the only published author in a well-known motorcycle publication in the room...
User avatar
rockchops
Meat Patty 1st Class
Meat Patty 1st Class
Posts: 706
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2016 12:24 pm

does a sheet of drywall fit in a gt3? asking for a friend
User avatar
CaleDeRoo
Senior Master Sirloin
Senior Master Sirloin
Posts: 8012
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:46 pm
Drives: C5
Location: CLT NC

There was some dirt nasty looking Porsches running through Watkins Glen one weekend I was there...
User avatar
troyguitar
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Posts: 20088
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:15 pm
Drives: Trek Domane
Location: Swamp

[user not found] wrote:Lots of jealousy in this thread. It's unbecoming.
Lots of vague near-insults here. It's robotic.
User avatar
CaleDeRoo
Senior Master Sirloin
Senior Master Sirloin
Posts: 8012
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:46 pm
Drives: C5
Location: CLT NC

rockchops wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:28 pm does a sheet of drywall fit in a gt3? asking for a friend
If you cut it into 2"x2" sections
User avatar
troyguitar
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Command Chief Master Sirloin
Posts: 20088
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:15 pm
Drives: Trek Domane
Location: Swamp

CaleDeRoo wrote:
rockchops wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:28 pm does a sheet of drywall fit in a gt3? asking for a friend
If you cut it into 2"x2" sections
:notbad:
Locked