:wrong: Soviet car reviews

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max225
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Been a while since I updated this.

Today I drove a "base" 2020 Defender. 56k msrp (somewhere 4k in options got added)

It literally caught my eye since we got a LR dealer close to my house and it was up front.

What was good about it ?
1. Driving position is pretty neat, "commanding" view of the road
2. Interior was excellent quality, much better than a comparable wrangler
3. Base model comes with everything you need, digital rear view mirror, homelink, keyless, led lights, safety tech (emergency braking+lane keep etc) etc.
4. Ride quality is AMAZING, absorbs everything you throw at it with ease, feels planted
5. Seems rather quiet inside also
6. Back seat room is cavernous.
7. I really like the styling, nothing else out there that looks similar
8. It is like a premium wrangler, with every wrangler issue addressed and improved, PERFECT for me, and without market adjustment it's even the same fking price.
9. 24 gallon gas tank :hubba:
10. Ergomics are excellent, you get in and you're pretty much at home, everything is super simple

What was not so great
1. Steering was super light and pretty lifeless
2. cloth interior somewhat reminded me of a "base model" golf, which @ 56k is a bit odd
3. :notsure: about the 2.slow... same size engine as my MINI and it weighs 2000lbs more, seemed ok but obviously didn't gun it
4. Unknown reliability and resale
5. It felt sort of big from certain angles... certainly bigger than a wrangler

Random notes:
10k market adjustment.... :lol: :disgusting:

Overall I'd say this vehicle is a home run. Distinctive styling, great ride quality, unique brand offering. I really like it. I'll see if they'll have some lease deals on these since this may be the best way to go. I highly recommend it... solid 4.5/7 I wonder how it will stack up against a bronco.... damn.

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:wrong:

That thing is hideous.
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CaleDeRoo
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Super neat. The steel wheels are cool, but the big :ramz: do look WAY better
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She’s a butterface
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Roof no come off :yuno:
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max225
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Tarspin wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:31 pm Roof no come off :yuno:
Yea omg no roof come off how will it be a true off Roader.

Surprised no one is appalled at the 10k mark up ... that’s 20% above msrp
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CaleDeRoo wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:22 pm Super neat. The steel wheels are cool, but the big :ramz: do look WAY better
I love the Steelies and they make the ride glide over anything.
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max225 wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:29 am
Tarspin wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:31 pm Roof no come off :yuno:
Yea omg no roof come off how will it be a true off Roader.

Surprised no one is appalled at the 10k mark up ... that’s 20% above msrp
I just can't pay 20% mark up on any depreciating asset in that price range. The whole $50k+ SUV craze is just silly to me but I'm in a place with ok roads and :mindblown: expensive real estate so my next car will likely be a used, reliable midsize car with a big trunk, or I'll inherit the wife's vehicle once the wheels fall off of the R.
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I think these LRs probably depreciate more like most Euro luxury SUVs (BMW/MB), and less like :jeep: Wronglers, Tacos and of course FJs unless they are really low volume or something.
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I think it looks pretty :neat:

Do they discount these? That is about $20K more than our :jeep: was, I wouldn't be down with that personally, but kind of a different (luxury) market/
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Can’t wait to see these all over the hood in 7 years.

The main problem is the Bronco is way cooler looking.
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D Griff wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:07 am I think it looks pretty :neat:

Do they discount these? That is about $20K more than our :jeep: was, I wouldn't be down with that personally, but kind of a different (luxury) market/
:bruh: what discount
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Johnny_P wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:10 am Can’t wait to see these all over the hood in 7 years.

The main problem is the Bronco is way cooler looking.
I do like the bronco a bit... but it’s another 6+ months away
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D Griff wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:07 am I think it looks pretty :neat:

Do they discount these? That is about $20K more than our :jeep: was, I wouldn't be down with that personally, but kind of a different (luxury) market/
It isn’t. Equip them equally and they are within 3-5k
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max225 wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:38 am
Johnny_P wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:10 am Can’t wait to see these all over the hood in 7 years.

The main problem is the Bronco is way cooler looking.
I do like the bronco a bit... but it’s another 6+ months away
I thought you wanted a useless pickup truck for house stuff? Does this actually solve any of your needs / desires?
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Johnny_P wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:43 am
max225 wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:38 am

I do like the bronco a bit... but it’s another 6+ months away
I thought you wanted a useless pickup truck for house stuff? Does this actually solve any of your needs / desires?
It solves some more than others. Ride quality and vadge and unique ness get checked off here. I think it would actually make a better daily and road trip vehicle than truk.
But ... resale/reliability/utility get completely canned
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max225 wrote:
Johnny_P wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:43 am I thought you wanted a useless pickup truck for house stuff? Does this actually solve any of your needs / desires?
It solves some more than others. Ride quality and vadge and unique ness get checked off here. I think it would actually make a better daily and road trip vehicle than truk.
But ... resale/reliability/utility get completely canned
That's why you buy both.

:fancy: :jeep: for :tits:

:truk: for :dong:
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troyguitar wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:54 am
max225 wrote: It solves some more than others. Ride quality and vadge and unique ness get checked off here. I think it would actually make a better daily and road trip vehicle than truk.
But ... resale/reliability/utility get completely canned
That's why you buy both.

:fancy: :jeep: for :tits:

:truk: for :dong:
You’re not :wrong: but I don’t have the space
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max225 wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:39 am
D Griff wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:07 am I think it looks pretty :neat:

Do they discount these? That is about $20K more than our :jeep: was, I wouldn't be down with that personally, but kind of a different (luxury) market/
It isn’t. Equip them equally and they are within 3-5k
:iono: even MSRP versus MSRP that is $15k more than my :jeep: which has leather, :fancy: wheels, and I think better off road capabilities. It has just a regular rear view mirror, not a screen :doe:
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D Griff wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:33 am
max225 wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:39 am

It isn’t. Equip them equally and they are within 3-5k
:iono: even MSRP versus MSRP that is $15k more than my :jeep: which has leather, :fancy: wheels, and I think better off road capabilities. It has just a regular rear view mirror, not a screen :doe:
Am I missing something ? A Sahara with a hard top and automatic leds and same level of “safety” is 47,500 this thing is 51. How are you getting 15k?
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max225 wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:42 am
D Griff wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:33 am

:iono: even MSRP versus MSRP that is $15k more than my :jeep: which has leather, :fancy: wheels, and I think better off road capabilities. It has just a regular rear view mirror, not a screen :doe:
Am I missing something ? A Sahara with a hard top and automatic leds and same level of “safety” is 47,500 this thing is 51. How are you getting 15k?
My car, $41K MSRP, paid $36K, has all of the aforementioned things :iono: I'm sure the RR has some more tech and stuff, but base model for $56K feels like a lot to me. I guess I view the "safety" as a downside but you're right in pointing it out, it obviously adds cost/complexity to the vehicle.
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DP
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D Griff wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:31 am
max225 wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:42 am
Am I missing something ? A Sahara with a hard top and automatic leds and same level of “safety” is 47,500 this thing is 51. How are you getting 15k?
My car, $41K MSRP, paid $36K, has all of the aforementioned things :iono: I'm sure the RR has some more tech and stuff, but base model for $56K feels like a lot to me. I guess I view the "safety" as a downside but you're right in pointing it out, it obviously adds cost/complexity to the vehicle.
That's a reasonable amount to pay for one of these, $ to fun ratio at it's best IMO. Roof comes off easy, the color is 5/7, features good, and will still get you where you need to get even in apocalyptic times.
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Tarspin wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:26 am
D Griff wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:31 am

My car, $41K MSRP, paid $36K, has all of the aforementioned things :iono: I'm sure the RR has some more tech and stuff, but base model for $56K feels like a lot to me. I guess I view the "safety" as a downside but you're right in pointing it out, it obviously adds cost/complexity to the vehicle.
That's a reasonable amount to pay for one of these, $ to fun ratio at it's best IMO. Roof comes off easy, the color is 5/7, features good, and will still get you where you need to get even in apocalyptic times.
:word:

I think I'm just out of touch/old at heart, but all of these "modern" features just mean the vehicle won't last as long to me. :ohwell: I guess this is why my comparison with the Defender isn't valid, I would never buy a Sahara either as a huge screen, self driving nannies, and whatever else you get are of negative value to me, I wouldn't be willing to pay $10-20K more for all that nonsense. I get the Rubicon a bit more if you're into wheeling as it's legit off road hardware that is likely better bang for buck than modding aftermarket. I'd put my money on a base Sport out off roading any Defender :doe:
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D Griff wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:47 am
Tarspin wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:26 am

That's a reasonable amount to pay for one of these, $ to fun ratio at it's best IMO. Roof comes off easy, the color is 5/7, features good, and will still get you where you need to get even in apocalyptic times.
:word:

I think I'm just out of touch/old at heart, but all of these "modern" features just mean the vehicle won't last as long to me. :ohwell: I guess this is why my comparison with the Defender isn't valid, I would never buy a Sahara either as a huge screen, self driving nannies, and whatever else you get are of negative value to me, I wouldn't be willing to pay $10-20K more for all that nonsense. I get the Rubicon a bit more if you're into wheeling as it's legit off road hardware that is likely better bang for buck than modding aftermarket. I'd put my money on a base Sport out off roading any Defender :doe:
You got to be realistic here. Once again the delta is not what you're quoting once you equip them the same, but I give up since this is beating a dead horse. I don't find keyless entry/led lights and a roof to be Negative features. They are not priced that differently.

It also comes with an adjustable suspension and rides beautifully. And I think you CAN put a number on that. Without a doubt it is less capable than a rubi, but it seems about on par with the others, except it actually drives nice.

That said, the real question is the bronco, because it is slightly cheaper and is styled very similarly. But I do wonder if it is built as well as the LR, which was pretty darn flawless inside and out.
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