Bringing this back up to actually say that you should definitely not do that. A turbo would be awesome, an LS would be dumb. Buy a C6 if you want an RX8-sized V8 sports car. I've looked into it and it's roughly $10k all-in to do a turbo right, keeping the car at basically 2900 lbs with 300 or so hp and retaining the high revs and super low polar moment provided by the stuffed up under the dash. Would be really really cool but also worthless at the same time.[user not found] wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:24 pm All this chat has just made me want to buy 's and drop an LS into it.
2020 Supra-Why I think it is half assed.
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troyguitar wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:14 pmBringing this back up to actually say that you should definitely not do that. A turbo would be awesome, an LS would be dumb. Buy a C6 if you want an RX8-sized V8 sports car. I've looked into it and it's roughly $10k all-in to do a turbo right, keeping the car at basically 2900 lbs with 300 or so hp and retaining the high revs and super low polar moment provided by the stuffed up under the dash. Would be really really cool but also worthless at the same time.[user not found] wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:24 pm All this chat has just made me want to buy 's and drop an LS into it.
As much as I like to think about swaps into things, a is basically the end result and way cheaper.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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It would be different if you were to swap it into something totally different, like say an E46 wagon or blown up 996... But a 3200 lb 106" wheelbase front-mid engine sports coupe with double wishbones all around is literally describing a C6 and an LS-powered RX8 at the same time. The hatch+targa beats the suicide doors every time for utility too.Detroit wrote:troyguitar wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:14 pm
Bringing this back up to actually say that you should definitely not do that. A turbo would be awesome, an LS would be dumb. Buy a C6 if you want an RX8-sized V8 sports car. I've looked into it and it's roughly $10k all-in to do a turbo right, keeping the car at basically 2900 lbs with 300 or so hp and retaining the high revs and super low polar moment provided by the stuffed up under the dash. Would be really really cool but also worthless at the same time.
As much as I like to think about swaps into things, a is basically the end result and way cheaper.
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A blown up 996 is still intriguing, but I'll probably never do it.troyguitar wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:22 pmIt would be different if you were to swap it into something totally different, like say an E46 wagon or blown up 996... But a 3200 lb 106" wheelbase front-mid engine sports coupe with double wishbones all around is literally describing a C6 and an LS-powered RX8 at the same time. The hatch+targa beats the suicide doors every time for utility too.Detroit wrote:
As much as I like to think about swaps into things, a is basically the end result and way cheaper.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Broham the B58 is a seriously underrated engine. It makes 320rwhp.....370ish is the real talk at the crank. I have no idea whether the 2JZ was also underrated.
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That's not the point you're comparing a current engine to something from 1994, times were different. You couldn't just message someone through your phone and send them fake digital money, while getting head and ordering dominos all through the same device at the same time.Desertbreh wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:35 pmBroham the B58 is a seriously underrated engine. It makes 320rwhp.....370ish is the real talk at the crank. I have no idea whether the 2JZ was also underrated.
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I think manufacturers should stop at 500hp. Want to make the car faster? Make it lighter. Add whizzbang transmissions, and hippie electric power. Anyone can add power and tire to a car.Acid666 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:04 pm I get the weak horsepower complaint. If you would of asked me this in my 20's I would of said this thing's a piece of shit. But now almost pushing 40 and doing lots of autocross and having a car with 400 to the wheels, those numbers don't mean as much to me. I'm more interested now in how the package works as a whole. These horsepower numbers that are coming out now are just ridiculous. Where does it end? 1K Hp for your daily? You don't need that baw!
I'm totally happy with my 128hp 1.8L that's likely down to 100hp in its current shape because it handles so well. So maybe the new Supra handles great, and weighs less ( I haven't looked at the numbers honestly). I think that price point is a little high (Let's face it, high starting parts is the new norm... When people are spending $40-50K for a baseline truck), but let's be real, a lot of people are going to be doing tuning on these things.
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I think lighter gets really expensive. Whereas more powerful doesn't really... +10K will get you 300hp more, but cutting out 1000lbs will cost 50k+NeonJonny wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:45 pmI think manufacturers should stop at 500hp. Want to make the car faster? Make it lighter. Add whizzbang transmissions, and hippie electric power. Anyone can add power and tire to a car.Acid666 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:04 pm I get the weak horsepower complaint. If you would of asked me this in my 20's I would of said this thing's a piece of shit. But now almost pushing 40 and doing lots of autocross and having a car with 400 to the wheels, those numbers don't mean as much to me. I'm more interested now in how the package works as a whole. These horsepower numbers that are coming out now are just ridiculous. Where does it end? 1K Hp for your daily? You don't need that baw!
I'm totally happy with my 128hp 1.8L that's likely down to 100hp in its current shape because it handles so well. So maybe the new Supra handles great, and weighs less ( I haven't looked at the numbers honestly). I think that price point is a little high (Let's face it, high starting parts is the new norm... When people are spending $40-50K for a baseline truck), but let's be real, a lot of people are going to be doing tuning on these things.
I actually like the way it looks. Yeah it sucks Toyota didn't do any sort of engine work and I think it is priced too high. $40k with a would've been the sweet spot.
https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-when ... 1831800550
https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-when ... 1831800550
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I like the Supra, but don't love it. The concept looked really aggressive and had me thinking supercar vs a refreshed 370Z which is kind of what it turns out to be. Nothing wrong with the production version but it doesn't exactly look like a supercar, and knowing Toyota, there are very few shareholders wanting to build two door sport coupes. Sure the designers and marketing staff want them released, but the machinery to make them costs billions and billions. It's dumb from a financial perspective unless you're pumping out Corvette volumes for decades off the same equipment. Hence BRZ/FRS/86, and now the Z4/Supra. Use someone else's assembly lines whenever possible.
To achieve their vision, they might have contemplated using the LFA footprint, by adding a few robots to that assembly process to build chunks of that car out of cheaper materials, strip out the costly tech and optioned it with their own V6 +TT with a , and give it the high priced V8 version for those who want something truly unique and impressive.
More shit talk:
Now if they went this route they would have truly born a legendary replacement, and probably have sold a few thousand examples per year. Which sounds like financial suicide unless their goal is to earn street cred for their beige cars with sport/F-Sport designations. Grounded to the ground Camry could be considered a respectable sports sedan in the car enthusast world come next gen, assuming they bolt on a couple of "supra" exclusive goodies, like stiffer suspension and the made up V6 turbo/ZF tranny.
Alas, their intentions are good, the product is okay, and once again playing it safe costs them some street cred in exchange for happier shareholders. So do they deserve ZOMG excitement from the average enthusiast for this release? Probably not, but the "Grounded to the Ground" buyer may fork out a little extra for the gloss black rims and sport bolstered seats in the 2020 Camry and imagine themselves behind the wheel of a Supra as they neutral drop into D while revving beside a Jetta at a random street light.
To achieve their vision, they might have contemplated using the LFA footprint, by adding a few robots to that assembly process to build chunks of that car out of cheaper materials, strip out the costly tech and optioned it with their own V6 +TT with a , and give it the high priced V8 version for those who want something truly unique and impressive.
More shit talk:
Now if they went this route they would have truly born a legendary replacement, and probably have sold a few thousand examples per year. Which sounds like financial suicide unless their goal is to earn street cred for their beige cars with sport/F-Sport designations. Grounded to the ground Camry could be considered a respectable sports sedan in the car enthusast world come next gen, assuming they bolt on a couple of "supra" exclusive goodies, like stiffer suspension and the made up V6 turbo/ZF tranny.
Alas, their intentions are good, the product is okay, and once again playing it safe costs them some street cred in exchange for happier shareholders. So do they deserve ZOMG excitement from the average enthusiast for this release? Probably not, but the "Grounded to the Ground" buyer may fork out a little extra for the gloss black rims and sport bolstered seats in the 2020 Camry and imagine themselves behind the wheel of a Supra as they neutral drop into D while revving beside a Jetta at a random street light.
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[user not found] wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:33 pmThey procrastinated nothing.MexicanYarisTK wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:30 pm
To be realistic, I think toyota thought the unthinkable and just debuted the concept. At the time, Toyota probably did not plan in regards of powerplant, transmission and it's driveability. I think the concept release alone, basically riled the audience waiting for the release. So Toyota basically rushed throughout the real supra release. Which explains why the news about BMW engine, chassis, trans, headunit, etc. has been disclosed just a few months back (I think). Toyota basically procasinated on a school project and did the assignment carelessly within following the guidelines and/or used the same approach as they did to the previous Supra. That's my observation.
They hyped it all, the internet gobbled it up, BMW and Toyota went to bed, and this is what was born several months later.
It's smaller than an M2, weighs less than an M2, has less power than an M2, and is hopefully razor sharp in terms of handling and dynamics. Is it a bad car? No. But it has big shoes to fill, and better shoes to compete against.
It really shouldn't be named the Supra.
They should have called this the new Celica.
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As the only published author in a well-known motorcycle publication in the room...
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An entire article about how a BMW chassis is remarkably BMW.Gberg2119 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:21 pm I actually like the way it looks. Yeah it sucks Toyota didn't do any sort of engine work and I think it is priced too high. $40k with a would've been the sweet spot.
https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-when ... 1831800550
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You can't price this that way when it sits on the lot next to a V6 Camry XLE/XSE priced at $40k.Gberg2119 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:21 pm I actually like the way it looks. Yeah it sucks Toyota didn't do any sort of engine work and I think it is priced too high. $40k with a would've been the sweet spot.
https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-when ... 1831800550
Hell, an original Supra Turbo was $40k in the mid 90's, and in today's money that's easily $65k now.
They've left room for a Celica nameplate in the middle of this and the 86, which has long been the plan from my time with Toyota.
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New Celica All Trac?fledonfoot wrote: ↑Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:32 pmYou can't price this that way when it sits on the lot next to a V6 Camry XLE/XSE priced at $40k.Gberg2119 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:21 pm I actually like the way it looks. Yeah it sucks Toyota didn't do any sort of engine work and I think it is priced too high. $40k with a would've been the sweet spot.
https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-when ... 1831800550
Hell, an original Supra Turbo was $40k in the mid 90's, and in today's money that's easily $65k now.
They've left room for a Celica nameplate in the middle of this and the 86, which has long been the plan from my time with Toyota.
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Finally read the review of the new Z4 in C&D last night. Aside from bemoaning the lack of a (of course), the author LOVED the thing. Basically said it was as good as a Boxster. Curious to see what the Supra reviews are like, but I'd expect it to be a more juvenile, hardtop version of the Z4. Supra could end up being really, really good.
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I don't understand how a front engine'd car is as good as a mid engined car. That writer is a turd.coogles wrote: ↑Thu Jan 17, 2019 2:01 pm Finally read the review of the new Z4 in C&D last night. Aside from bemoaning the lack of a (of course), the author LOVED the thing. Basically said it was as good as a Boxster. Curious to see what the Supra reviews are like, but I'd expect it to be a more juvenile, hardtop version of the Z4. Supra could end up being really, really good.
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No mid engine 10k RPM manual diesel V12 brown wagon no care.
It's a MK2 370Z with an engine from a BMW family sedan and an automatic shared with a Ram pickup truck.
It's a MK2 370Z with an engine from a BMW family sedan and an automatic shared with a Ram pickup truck.