Car talk tré: Carpocalypse Now!

[Johnny_P]

Hybrids make more sense in most of the country. Small gas engine for highway, small electric motor for city, both together for acceleration.

I want a small sporty hybrid, too bad the CRZ is the only real offering in that space so far and it was terrible.

Was it? I've never driven one but they look really cool, IMO. Some auto journalists seem to think they're fun and they've depreciated immensely.

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Yeah it was bad. Little to no advantage over a typical gas engine vehicle.

[ChrisoftheNorth]

Interesting thought, but would there be room in such a tiny platform for the battery ?

If it's mid-engined, like the MR2 - put the battery up front and down low. Would help with weight distribution.

Or just make the battery the floor.

[troyguitar]

Was it? I've never driven one but they look really cool, IMO. Some auto journalists seem to think they're fun and they've depreciated immensely.

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Yeah it was bad. Little to no advantage over a typical gas engine vehicle.

Yeah they're not actually terrible but they're rather pointless. They're neither significantly lighter, nor faster, nor more efficient than the Fit upon which they're based... and you can't see out the back. They were ahead of their time on the visibility front!

[troyguitar]

If it's mid-engined, like the MR2 - put the battery up front and down low. Would help with weight distribution.

Or just make the battery the floor.

Battery integrated into the center of the chassis, fuel tank in front, engine in rear, probably even have space to do a rear hatch/trunk like on a Cayman and end up under 3k lbs no problem. No profit because everyone wants a to haul their 2.2 kids and you must be able to do 0-60 under 5 seconds in order to have any fun whatsoever.

[Johnny_P]

I don't think hybrids make sense period. Having two systems doing the same thing makes no sense. Tesla has proven this.

They make a lot of sense in areas that don't have adequate infrastructure to support electric only. Because of this, they currently make a lot more sense in cities than electrics do, sadly.

[ChrisoftheNorth]

I really wish Toyota made the SF-R.



If Honda can make some coin on bikes like the Grom and the Monkey, why can't Toyota and Honda do the same with cars like this?

My guess is cost of cars to develop for safety, efficiency, etc. Cars are ridiculously expensive to develop.

[ChrisoftheNorth]

Or just make the battery the floor.

Battery integrated into the center of the chassis, fuel tank in front, engine in rear, probably even have space to do a rear hatch/trunk like on a Cayman and end up under 3k lbs no problem. No profit because everyone wants a to haul their 2.2 kids and you must be able to do 0-60 under 5 seconds in order to have any fun whatsoever.

That would be a ton of fun. 5/7 would drive.

[Johnny_P]

I really wish Toyota made the SF-R.



If Honda can make some coin on bikes like the Grom and the Monkey, why can't Toyota and Honda do the same with cars like this?

My guess is cost of cars to develop for safety, efficiency, etc. Cars are ridiculously expensive to develop.

Just rebadge a miata RF. That's what it looks like anyway.

[Johnny_P]

Battery integrated into the center of the chassis, fuel tank in front, engine in rear, probably even have space to do a rear hatch/trunk like on a Cayman and end up under 3k lbs no problem. No profit because everyone wants a to haul their 2.2 kids and you must be able to do 0-60 under 5 seconds in order to have any fun whatsoever.

That would be a ton of fun. 5/7 would drive.

There are rumors that the next STI will be electric hybrid. That would be interesting af.

[Johnny_P]

Just rebadge a miata RF. That's what it looks like anyway.

I love the way the RF looks but hate that it has the complicated tomfoolery of the top.

I want a fixed roof for lightness/rigidity.

Miata hardtop coupe then. With the new corolla motor. Done?

[troyguitar]

Just rebadge a miata RF. That's what it looks like anyway.

I love the way the RF looks but hate that it has the complicated tomfoolery of the top.

I want a fixed roof for lightness/rigidity.

Reports also indicate that you can't see out the back of the RF and it's not any less loud than the soft top anyway with the top up, so it seems like a waste of money if those things are all true.

[Apex]

Miata hardtop coupe then. With the new corolla motor. Done?

Shame OE hardtops are so hard to find for my car. I love the convertible life but hardtop with a roll bar and removed soft top would be awesome.

Build one out of pvc and duct tape.

[troyguitar]

Shame OE hardtops are so hard to find for my car. I love the convertible life but hardtop with a roll bar and removed soft top would be awesome.

Build one out of pvc and duct tape.

[Apex]

Build one out of pvc and duct tape.

Seems legit.

[dubshow]

That would be a ton of fun. 5/7 would drive.

There are rumors that the next STI will be electric hybrid. That would be interesting af.

every hot enthusiast brand has said something to this affect.

[dubshow]

Just rebadge a miata RF. That's what it looks like anyway.

I love the way the RF looks but hate that it has the complicated tomfoolery of the top.

I want a fixed roof for lightness/rigidity.

I was watching one open and close. Very for me in terms of buying one. But I was all from the tease previews. Now, very meh.

[max225]

Every hybrid weighs 350-500lbs more than its counterpart, then add the reliability issues of merging the two, engineering expenses to add all that cost etc, space taken up by the battery, since at this point you have two engines and two "fuel" tanks.

Fuel is not expensive enough to warrant duplicative systems, it won't happen until around $7 a gallon or more. A civic sport drives way better than a prius, should have higher reliability, has fewer parts, cheaper to maintain, and is cheaper to purchase. 32/38MPG seems plenty on donkey piss to not worry about the cost of fuel.

Prius is undeniably reliable, but it is undeniably heavier and more expensive down the road to maintain than a corolla of the same year. The prius batteries last about 150-200k miles, then need refurb or replacement. That expense is NON-existant on a corolla.

[max225]

Miata hardtop coupe then. With the new corolla motor. Done?

Shame OE hardtops are so hard to find for my car. I love the convertible life but hardtop with a roll bar and removed soft top would be awesome.

Why not BRZ at that point. Removing the soft top to put on a hard top and rollbar seems

[max225]

I don't think hybrids make sense period. Having two systems doing the same thing makes no sense. Tesla has proven this.

They make a lot of sense in areas that don't have adequate infrastructure to support electric only. Because of this, they currently make a lot more sense in cities than electrics do, sadly.

I disagree. I think a fuel-efficient small car makes more sense, the additional cost of a hybrid simply isn't' offset in the lifetime ownershit of a vehicle. It is a senseless undertaking.

[max225]

Why not BRZ at that point. Removing the soft top to put on a hard top and rollbar seems

It is.

Downside to the BRZ is the engine.

Dem 40k near engine out plug changes.... but for some odd reason i keep seeing the BRZs all over the place lately. To me the stigma of that car is the worst part, similar to a WRX. Most are somehow ragged on sticker bombed... slammed, have some obnoxious exhaust even though have no power etc. It is quite sad. They are great driving vehicles.

[troyguitar]

Prius is undeniably reliable, but it is undeniably heavier and more expensive down the road to maintain than a corolla of the same year. The prius batteries last about 150-200k miles, then need refurb or replacement. That expense is NON-existant on a corolla.

The difference between a Prius and Corolla is minimal, actually.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/20 ... est-review

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/20 ... est-review

The Prius is slightly faster and less than 100 lbs heavier while getting 53/58 mpg vs 28/35. Prius also has more cargo space by a lot and costs only $1k more up front.

[troyguitar]

Dem 40k near engine out plug changes.... but for some odd reason i keep seeing the BRZs all over the place lately. To me the stigma of that car is the worst part, similar to a WRX. Most are somehow ragged on sticker bombed... slammed, have some obnoxious exhaust even though have no power etc. It is quite sad. They are great driving vehicles.

Fantastic cars when new. Truly sublime from behind the wheel.

But yeah, that plug change is a big from me.

The is like working with legos. So easy to work on.

engines and simple designs really make for an easy car to work on. Plugs in the can be done in <30 minutes with just a few extensions through the driver's front wheel well.

[max225]

Prius is undeniably reliable, but it is undeniably heavier and more expensive down the road to maintain than a corolla of the same year. The prius batteries last about 150-200k miles, then need refurb or replacement. That expense is NON-existant on a corolla.

The difference between a Prius and Corolla is minimal, actually.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/20 ... est-review

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/20 ... est-review

The Prius is slightly faster and less than 100 lbs heavier while getting 53/58 mpg vs 28/35. Prius also has more cargo space by a lot and costs only $1k more up front.

19 vs 24k is :yuge: but Yodas are nice, you can't go wrong with either. I don't mind the Prius for what it is, personally wouldn't go that route but I can't blame those that do, it is a wise choice.

[max225]

Speaking of... I just changed a Mazda 3 cam position sensor in all of 2 min. Good luck doing that on anything else.

[troyguitar]

The corolla is $24k and prius is $25k

$19k not found, that's poverty brand pricing.