Car Talk 5: The Juice is Loose!

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D Griff
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Saw a Taycan in the wild today :doe: , it was :nice:

The electric stuff in my price range? :gag:
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D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:37 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:16 pm

You can always have a new Tesla roadster for 250k

Rivian is starting to make decent looking stuff too...
Lucid apparently finished their fucktory

Electric cars are just getting started. First gasoline cars were carriages with a motor ... it will evolve over time.
I'm not 100% opted in yet...

Do we have enough raw materials for batteries to replace the huge volume of ICE vehicles?

Will those materials still be affordable if demand goes up 20X?

Is electric really better for the planet? (this really depends on where you live)

I have zero interest in electric so far, we shall see what comes in the future, but I will likely be sticking with old shit as long as I can as I just like it better.
I'd still rather have a sporty hybrid. A small battery and small motor is plenty to make a car both more efficient and faster without adding a ton of weight/size if done right. See: Rav4 hybrid vs standard, the hybrid is better in every way.
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troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:40 pm
D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:37 pm

I'm not 100% opted in yet...

Do we have enough raw materials for batteries to replace the huge volume of ICE vehicles?

Will those materials still be affordable if demand goes up 20X?

Is electric really better for the planet? (this really depends on where you live)

I have zero interest in electric so far, we shall see what comes in the future, but I will likely be sticking with old shit as long as I can as I just like it better.
I'd still rather have a sporty hybrid. A small battery and small motor is plenty to make a car both more efficient and faster without adding a ton of weight/size if done right. See: Rav4 hybrid vs standard, the hybrid is better in every way.
:notwrong: The CR-Z was a :neat: idea, too bad it didn't sell. It would be pretty sweet to see the Rav4 power train applied with a :manuel: to something like a Corolla hatch for a little rally fun hot hatch thing. Problem is, all of us would be too :scrooge: to buy it.
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D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:03 pm
coogles wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 11:21 am The digi-dash is fucking gross. And cheap-looking.

What has more visual interest, a Rolex or an Apple watch? The Rolex has the same qualities now as it will 100 years from now, but that Apple watch could be programmed by Apple, by Google, by fucking Fisher-Price and no one would know the difference looking at it on someone else's wrist, and a year from now there will be a new one out and everyone will be ready to ditch last year's model. Every car is designed in a wind tunnel to look exactly the same, every new car has screens everywhere and are starting to look exactly the same. You can't even build quality into button feel anymore with capacitive bullshit everywhere. I might as well ride around in a golf cart with an iPad my face, it'd be the same experience.
:lolol: I always love your feedback on digital/touch screen shit in cars. I am in total agreeance.

I :wub: the gayges and controls in my shitty ass C5, TBH, even if the rest of the interior is still :gag:
:bow:

C5 interior has many problems, but the gayges aren't one of them. If you can fix the seats, steering wheel, and :manuel: shift knob the C5 interior improves dramatically.
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D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:37 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:16 pm

You can always have a new Tesla roadster for 250k

Rivian is starting to make decent looking stuff too...
Lucid apparently finished their fucktory

Electric cars are just getting started. First gasoline cars were carriages with a motor ... it will evolve over time.
I'm not 100% opted in yet...

Do we have enough raw materials for batteries to replace the huge volume of ICE vehicles?

Will those materials still be affordable if demand goes up 20X?

Is electric really better for the planet? (this really depends on where you live)

I have zero interest in electric so far, we shall see what comes in the future, but I will likely be sticking with old shit as long as I can as I just like it better.
Humans are bad for the planet period, but we keep breeding so ... whether you’re moving mountains to mine lithium and rare earths or polluting the oceans with dead Dino’s. Pick your poison.
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D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:57 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:40 pm

I'd still rather have a sporty hybrid. A small battery and small motor is plenty to make a car both more efficient and faster without adding a ton of weight/size if done right. See: Rav4 hybrid vs standard, the hybrid is better in every way.
:notwrong: The CR-Z was a :neat: idea, too bad it didn't sell. It would be pretty sweet to see the Rav4 power train applied with a :manuel: to something like a Corolla hatch for a little rally fun hot hatch thing. Problem is, all of us would be too :scrooge: to buy it.
I'm OK with it being automatic at this point for something that's otherwise interesting, useful, fun, and affordable. I'm less OK with everything being a god damn SUV. I do not want to sit up high on what is effectively a bench seat.
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troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:49 pm
D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:57 pm

:notwrong: The CR-Z was a :neat: idea, too bad it didn't sell. It would be pretty sweet to see the Rav4 power train applied with a :manuel: to something like a Corolla hatch for a little rally fun hot hatch thing. Problem is, all of us would be too :scrooge: to buy it.
I'm OK with it being automatic at this point for something that's otherwise interesting, useful, fun, and affordable. I'm less OK with everything being a god damn SUV. I do not want to sit up high on what is effectively a bench seat.
Why not ? Sometimes driving a couch is nice AF
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:31 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:49 pm

I'm OK with it being automatic at this point for something that's otherwise interesting, useful, fun, and affordable. I'm less OK with everything being a god damn SUV. I do not want to sit up high on what is effectively a bench seat.
Why not ? Sometimes driving a couch is nice AF
I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
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troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:54 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:31 pm

Why not ? Sometimes driving a couch is nice AF
I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:54 pm

I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
All of :dat:
Melon wrote: Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:41 pm Don't discuss things you want on here.

This is only a place for 100% facts.
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D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:38 pm Saw a Taycan in the wild today :doe: , it was :nice:

The electric stuff in my price range? :gag:
I drove a model 3 and stepped the ass end out going through a round-about. I’d totally own one.
Melon wrote: Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:41 pm Don't discuss things you want on here.

This is only a place for 100% facts.
...doesn’t argue cars on a political forum
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:54 pm

I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
I drove a V6 Charger for 8 days when my Mk6 was totaled and it was...ok I guess? Was not a fan :doe:
Re the bolded, I'd only answer parking the bitch. I never parked it in my garage and pulling or backing into a spot at work took more concentration than an egg.
:wap: Where are these mangos?
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wap wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:27 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm

As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
I drove a V6 Charger for 8 days when my Mk6 was totaled and it was...ok I guess? Was not a fan :doe:
Re the bolded, I'd only answer parking the bitch. I never parked it in my garage and pulling or backing into a spot at work took more concentration than an egg.
As clearly indicated no where did I state it was fun. I specifically stated that it was relaxing. yes parking my 212" taco in my garage requires more concentration than my 152" mini, however driving the taco is FAR more relaxing. The argument is not whether a Charger is worse of a car than a Golf, but :mahtroy: clearly stated that he encounters more STRESS driving bigger vehicles without body hugging seats and big anti sway bars that prevent roll etc. Trying to understand :butwhy: in normal operating conditions.
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:54 pm

I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
It's not fine for me. My first car was a Buick. My last car was a Lincoln. I've spent a lot of time driving various Suburbans, full-size vans, RV's, and a minivan or two. I find it absolutely nerve-wracking to drive big shit. The margins for error are so much smaller and you have no feedback or responsiveness to help you act within those margins.

Driving around just in our neighborhood is already annoying in a small car when you've got a :truk: coming the other way and more :truk: :truk: :truk: parked along both sides of the roads which were built 150 years ago for horses.
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troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:45 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm

As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
It's not fine for me. My first car was a Buick. My last car was a Lincoln. I've spent a lot of time driving various Suburbans, full-size vans, RV's, and a minivan or two. I find it absolutely nerve-wracking to drive big shit. The margins for error are so much smaller and you have no feedback or responsiveness to help you act within those margins.

Driving around just in our neighborhood is already annoying in a small car when you've got a :truk: coming the other way and more :truk: :truk: :truk: parked along both sides of the roads which were built 150 years ago for horses.
That last argument certainly applies to the first cities in the union but the vast majority of this country was built with giant cars in mind. We’re not in communist Europe after all.

I suppose my stress of limited visibility and suspension travel, coupled with being surrounded by 5000lb behemoths on the daily far outweighs the parking troubles
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:iono:

I like both when possible. In an ideal scenario I’d rock a Raptor/TRX and a GT3 in the stable. Want to enjoy Baja blasting over traffic? Raptor/TRX. Want to shatter your anus in the 405? GT3
:doughnut: :narc: :doughnut:
Desertbreh wrote: Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:05 pm DFD. The forum where everybody makes the same choices and then tells anybody trying to join the club that they are the stupidest motherfucker to ever walk the earth.
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:30 pm
wap wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:27 pm
I drove a V6 Charger for 8 days when my Mk6 was totaled and it was...ok I guess? Was not a fan :doe:
Re the bolded, I'd only answer parking the bitch. I never parked it in my garage and pulling or backing into a spot at work took more concentration than an egg.
As clearly indicated no where did I state it was fun. I specifically stated that it was relaxing. yes parking my 212" taco in my garage requires more concentration than my 152" mini, however driving the taco is FAR more relaxing. The argument is not whether a Charger is worse of a car than a Golf, but :mahtroy: clearly stated that he encounters more STRESS driving bigger vehicles without body hugging seats and big anti sway bars that prevent roll etc. Trying to understand :butwhy: in normal operating conditions.
As :mahtroy: said above, no feedback, wallowy in curves, less margin for error, corners way out in the distance make placing the car where you want it more challenging.
:wap: Where are these mangos?
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wap wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 5:12 pm
max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:30 pm
As clearly indicated no where did I state it was fun. I specifically stated that it was relaxing. yes parking my 212" taco in my garage requires more concentration than my 152" mini, however driving the taco is FAR more relaxing. The argument is not whether a Charger is worse of a car than a Golf, but :mahtroy: clearly stated that he encounters more STRESS driving bigger vehicles without body hugging seats and big anti sway bars that prevent roll etc. Trying to understand :butwhy: in normal operating conditions.
As :mahtroy: said above, no feedback, wallowy in curves, less margin for error, corners way out in the distance make placing the car where you want it more challenging.
That’s only if you try to drive a Charger like a GTI
:doughnut: :narc: :doughnut:
Desertbreh wrote: Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:05 pm DFD. The forum where everybody makes the same choices and then tells anybody trying to join the club that they are the stupidest motherfucker to ever walk the earth.
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I am with :mahtroy: here. I find driving the :jeep: is significantly more stressful than the :poorvette: and I am therefor less comfy, despite it riding way better and being far more couch like.

I have almost 100K logged in a Bang Bus, I can do it better than many people, but it still sucks.
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I found my BMW far too luxo to really enjoy it that much, and it had no features and every "sport" option ticked... Meh, give me an anus shatterer all day every day.
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4zilch wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:25 pm
D Griff wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:38 pm Saw a Taycan in the wild today :doe: , it was :nice:

The electric stuff in my price range? :gag:
I drove a model 3 and stepped the ass end out going through a round-about. I’d totally own one.
They are :notbad: but also not in my price range :lolol:

The Model S P90D I've driven was not really my thing but it was certainly :impressive: and fun in its own way.
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The ID.3, C3 Cactus, and Cutlass Supreme are all awesome looking. DFD is blind
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razr390 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:51 pm :iono:

I like both when possible. In an ideal scenario I’d rock a Raptor/TRX and a GT3 in the stable. Want to enjoy Baja blasting over traffic? Raptor/TRX. Want to shatter your anus in the 405? GT3
Lexus LS460 + MR2
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max225 wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:08 pm
troyguitar wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:54 pm

I find it nothing but stressful to be in a giant unresponsive barge that flops my ass to and fro when I turn the wheel and I have no need to lord myself over everyone else on the road. Parking is a huge pain too.
As long as you’re under 80” and 240” it’s perfectly fine. Turning the wheel ? Life isn’t a race track most roads are straight af, you encounter what ? .2 Gs tops by adhering to speed limits? Not saying it’s FUN, but we share the road with garbage trucks, vehicles with trailers semis, rvs etc.

I think you’d be surprised how relaxing it is to drive a barge down the street vs something anus shattering that splits a wheel by hitting an ant. I’d seriously like to understand what is stressful about driving a large comfortable vehicle. (In most environments outside of NYC and SF)
:dat: I have started to grown for crossovers sadly, but absolutely do hate CVT's doe regardless. Also we just rented the new rav4, that doesn't even have a cvt and it actually drives :notbad: It really depends on what kind you drive though that doesn't provide a teeny bit feedback where you're essentially forced to baby it as you turn.
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CaleDeRoo wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:19 pm The ID.3, C3 Cactus, and Cutlass Supreme are all awesome looking. DFD is blind
:dat:
I'm a nephew of a :plac:
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