coogles wrote:
I'm a goaltender, so only going 100% when I need to. But I also don't get to sit my ass down and rest ever. So, yeah, my ability to walk the next day has a lot to do with how many shots I face and how shitty the defense in front of me is on any given night.
When I ride I don't sprint 100% the entire time, I spin at a cadence where I don't have a massive buildup of lactic acid, but no lower. The bike paths / roadie trails near me all have cross streets where a rider will need to stop and start back up again, so I sprint away from those before I settle in to a high pace but one I can hold basically indefinitely. It's like a base pace while running - you could do it for 20+ minutes, but any faster and you'd burn out in 4-5.
Ah I've never played goal, no idea how it feels. Running never had a base pace for me though (unless you count walking, I couldn't run even at 10 min/mile for 6 hours straight) - and casual runners don't go out for 4+ hours. That's where I'm struggling to understand this shit... 4 hours is a marathon at a slow pace, that's super serious runner territory requiring lots of training - and not doing it multiple times a week.
Are cyclists just way more fit than runners? Are DFD members all former tour de France winners who thought it was too easy?
You burn fewer calories per hour cycling than you do running. It’s a more efficient means of transport since your is being held up by something.
No, definitely be a Fred. Wear weird clothing on a shitty bike and pass all the dudes on their $5,000 bikes who dress like they're on a leg of the Tour de France.
This is why the Schwinn hangs around - I enjoy embarrassing people on that bike.
The CAAD wasn't the Schwinn by any means, but I've always wondered why so many people spend more money than that on a roadie. I'd see some out of shape dude with his knees cocked way out to the side because his belly is in the way riding a full aero bike in a full kit going all of 14mph in the flat sections like . I'd cruise by in a t-shirt and cotton shorts cruising at 22 and just wonder what these kinds of people are doing spending so much money on something they suck at so badly. Now don't get me wrong, I'd occasionally get passed by some badass who'd fly by me like I'm standing still while I'm pushing like crazy to try to keep up, but those people clearly spent a lot more time riding than I do.
Although pot/kettle/black for me with the Trance. It's way more bike than I'm capable of making use of.
[user not found] wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 5:15 pm
This is why the Schwinn hangs around - I enjoy embarrassing people on that bike.
The CAAD wasn't the Schwinn by any means, but I've always wondered why so many people spend more money than that on a roadie. I'd see some out of shape dude with his knees cocked way out to the side because his belly is in the way riding a full aero bike in a full kit going all of 14mph in the flat sections like . I'd cruise by in a t-shirt and cotton shorts cruising at 22 and just wonder what these kinds of people are doing spending so much money on something they suck at so badly. Now don't get me wrong, I'd occasionally get passed by some badass who'd fly by me like I'm standing still while I'm pushing like crazy to try to keep up, but those people clearly spent a lot more time riding than I do.
Although pot/kettle/black for me with the Trance. It's way more bike than I'm capable of making use of.
Anyone who rides slower than me is a moron and anyone who rides faster is a maniac!
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 5:25 pm
Anyone who rides slower than me is a moron and anyone who rides faster is a maniac!
Basically. But really, I only roll my eyes at the people who are markedly slower than me (a guy who's a halfway decent athlete but barely rides) but are riding super high-priced bikes appearing to think doing so will make them look cooler or ride faster. No problems with someone out there getting started in the hobby who just isn't fast. We've all been there in some sort of athletic endeavor.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 5:25 pm
Anyone who rides slower than me is a moron and anyone who rides faster is a maniac!
Basically. But really, I only roll my eyes at the people who are markedly slower than me (a guy who's a halfway decent athlete but barely rides) but are riding super high-priced bikes appearing to think doing so will make them look cooler or ride faster. No problems with someone out there getting started in the hobby who just isn't fast. We've all been there in some sort of athletic endeavor.
I'm legit curious how much difference a bike, fit, and kit would actually make even for me
Each individual component might be worth "not that much" but it probably adds up to a significant amount. Assuming that the Strava wattage estimate is remotely in the ballpark, then a 40 watt savings from going would make me a lot faster... I'm supposedly only doing 120ish watts in the first place.
I'm legit curious how much difference a bike, fit, and kit would actually make even for me
Each individual component might be worth "not that much" but it probably adds up to a significant amount. Assuming that the Strava wattage estimate is remotely in the ballpark, then a 40 watt savings from going would make me a lot faster... I'm supposedly only doing 120ish watts in the first place.
The Strava watt estimates aren’t far off, my friend I rode with yesterday had a power meter, and his average power on one segment was 351.
Strava estimated mine to be 347 on the same segment. He’s a little heavier, I’m a little lighter, but the split on the segment was 2 seconds.
Here’s his data on this segment:
So am I in concluding that better gear would actually make more of a difference for me than for you? A reduction in losses of X watts is going to represent way more percentage change in power "to the wheels" for me, plus the faster you go the more extra power it takes to make any difference anyway since drag is exponential.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:02 pm
So am I in concluding that better gear would actually make more of a difference for me than for you? A reduction in losses of X watts is going to represent way more percentage change in power "to the wheels" for me, plus the faster you go the more extra power it takes to make any difference anyway since drag is exponential.
I think it'll make a smaller difference than you think. You might gain a little speed due to gains in aerodynamics, loss in weight, or decrease in watt losses, but your FTP (functional threshold power) won't change. Your FTP is the amount of power you can sustain for one hour. What will make the biggest differences for you will be proper road bike tires, improving overall core fitness, and a bike fit.
For reference: My FTP is somewhere around 300 watts. I should probably do a FTP test on the Peloton this week to see where I'm at.
I know that tires are the biggest thing, but they are a really big thing if I'm interpreting test results correctly... Like 20+ watts per tire from tires alone, or a 25+% increase in power output for me. How could that not make a big difference?
That’s the nice thing about the bike you bought Troy. It’s super easy to switch to a slick road tire without changing anything else and turn it into a road bike. Or keep the knobbies and it’s almost a mountain bike. Very versatile.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:29 pm
I know that tires are the biggest thing, but they are a really big thing if I'm interpreting test results correctly... Like 20+ watts per tire from tires alone, or a 25+% increase in power output for me. How could that not make a big difference?
Off road tires increase resistance on pavement. Resistance is great for training as it requires more power to maintain a given speed, which will increase your fitness and endurance, but that same resistance is bad for overall speed.
My MTB, if I'm humming along at 20 MPH, I can actually hear the treads cutting through the air and slapping the pavement. So, you may be putting power down, but the resistance from the tires is a loss, which counterbalances your power input. Consider it similar to drivetrain losses when dynoing a car.
If you can get fit and fast on the bike you have, the difference when you jump to a new bike will be greater than it is right now.
Either way I'm not buying anything new this year so it is what it is... I do think that I'll blow the $$$$ on a stupid zwift trainer though so that next year I can be in decent enough shape to try out riding with other people.
The main thing I'd like to do is simply try a bunch of different stuff, from skinny road bikes to full suspension mountain bikes and across the whole range of pricing and geometry. Can't do it without living in a real city
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:02 pm
The main thing I'd like to do is simply try a bunch of different stuff, from skinny road bikes to full suspension mountain bikes and across the whole range of pricing and geometry. Can't do it without living in a real city
[user not found] wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:23 pmFor reference: My FTP is somewhere around 300 watts. I should probably do a FTP test on the Peloton this week to see where I'm at.
This made me curious what mine would be, so I hopped on a spin bike this morning to see what kind of wattage I could sustain. After a few minutes of warming up I settled into the ~200 range and felt like I could keep that pace for quite awhile. Get closer to 220-240, though, and I’d start having some lactic acid buildup over the course of a minute or two. I tried 300 to see what that would feel like and I’d get all of about 30 seconds before I’d really have to push through some burn to keep that going.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:02 pm
The main thing I'd like to do is simply try a bunch of different stuff, from skinny road bikes to full suspension mountain bikes and across the whole range of pricing and geometry. Can't do it without living in a real city
Keep an eye out for demo days. All the big brands have them - Trek, Giant, Specialized. Trick is knowing about them.
I can't imagine that they do that anywhere near me, but I guess I'd be down for the 8 hour round trip drive to get to a big shop if I knew that I could try a bunch of stuff.
My "mod of the day" on the bike for today was to remove the visor from my helmet. The increased vertical field of view seems to have made a fairly big difference in forward visibility, making it so I don't have to bend my neck as far back to see the road.
$1350 for full carbon w/ 6800 ultegra and hydraulic brakes in my size with about the same geometry as my current bike. Missing crankset but those aren't that expensive. Can't afford not to buy it!
Keep an eye out for demo days. All the big brands have them - Trek, Giant, Specialized. Trick is knowing about them.
I can't imagine that they do that anywhere near me, but I guess I'd be down for the 8 hour round trip drive to get to a big shop if I knew that I could try a bunch of stuff.
My "mod of the day" on the bike for today was to remove the visor from my helmet. The increased vertical field of view seems to have made a fairly big difference in forward visibility, making it so I don't have to bend my neck as far back to see the road.
$1350 for full carbon w/ 6800 ultegra and hydraulic brakes in my size with about the same geometry as my current bike. Missing crankset but those aren't that expensive. Can't afford not to buy it!
Demo days usually take place at trails/parks...not always shops. You might get lucky and not have to drive 8 hours round trip.
Never heard of bikeisland...but I don't see how you can pass this up if it's legit. You'd be losing money, you can't afford not to pull the trigger.
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm
My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
Bike Island is the returns/scratch&dent/closeout site for Bikes Direct. I got my bike from them in the first place for $200 less than the current models because it has the old cable routing and paint color.
They've got a white one in my size too for $600 with a lot less shit included, could be to build it up with a mix of whatever components - like maybe the new Shimano GRX "gravel" rear derailleur, some and whatnot.
Apparently even the regular "medium cage" road derailleurs of the current gen Shimano design are actually capable of working with the 11-40 MTB cassettes despite the official specs saying that it won't work.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:40 pm
Bike Island is the returns/scratch&dent/closeout site for Bikes Direct. I got my bike from them in the first place for $200 less than the current models because it has the old cable routing and paint color.
They've got a white one in my size too for $600 with a lot less shit included, could be to build it up with a mix of whatever components - like maybe the new Shimano GRX "gravel" rear derailleur, some and whatnot.
Apparently even the regular "medium cage" road derailleurs of the current gen Shimano design are actually capable of working with the 11-40 MTB cassettes despite the official specs saying that it won't work.
A 50/34 crank with 11-40 cassette seems like it would cover anything I'd ever need without any issues.
Oh wow,
Desertbreh wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm
My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:40 pm
Bike Island is the returns/scratch&dent/closeout site for Bikes Direct. I got my bike from them in the first place for $200 less than the current models because it has the old cable routing and paint color.
They've got a white one in my size too for $600 with a lot less shit included, could be to build it up with a mix of whatever components - like maybe the new Shimano GRX "gravel" rear derailleur, some and whatnot.
Apparently even the regular "medium cage" road derailleurs of the current gen Shimano design are actually capable of working with the 11-40 MTB cassettes despite the official specs saying that it won't work.
A 50/34 crank with 11-40 cassette seems like it would cover anything I'd ever need without any issues.
Shimano rear road derailleur can only wrap 39 teeth. What you described is 45. Won’t work if you cross chain it in big big you will rip the derailleur off the frame.
Also that bike ain’t much different than your existing one only it has slick tires. Seems it would be a hell of a lot cheaper to just install slick road tires on your existing bike. Just 2 tires and 2 tubes.
troyguitar wrote: ↑Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:40 pm
Bike Island is the returns/scratch&dent/closeout site for Bikes Direct. I got my bike from them in the first place for $200 less than the current models because it has the old cable routing and paint color.
They've got a white one in my size too for $600 with a lot less shit included, could be to build it up with a mix of whatever components - like maybe the new Shimano GRX "gravel" rear derailleur, some and whatnot.
Apparently even the regular "medium cage" road derailleurs of the current gen Shimano design are actually capable of working with the 11-40 MTB cassettes despite the official specs saying that it won't work.
A 50/34 crank with 11-40 cassette seems like it would cover anything I'd ever need without any issues.
Shimano rear road derailleur can only wrap 39 teeth. What you described is 45. Won’t work if you cross chain it in big big you will rip the derailleur off the frame.
Dudebro claims to have run the road derailleur with 11-40 mtb cassette and he's not the only one.
If carbon+11sp hydraulic full ultegra is the same as al+8sp mechanical claris+tourney, then I don't understand anything at all about bikes. So weight doesn't matter, materials don't matter, bearings don't matter, gears don't matter, nothing matters but tires? Why the fuck do you guys all have multiple expensive bikes if nothing matters?
Johnny_P wrote:
Shimano rear road derailleur can only wrap 39 teeth. What you described is 45. Won’t work if you cross chain it in big big you will rip the derailleur off the frame.
Dudebro claims to have run the road derailleur with 11-40 mtb cassette and he's not the only one.
If carbon+11sp hydraulic full ultegra is the same as al+8sp mechanical claris+tourney, then I don't understand anything at all about bikes. So weight doesn't matter, materials don't matter, bearings don't matter, gears don't matter, nothing matters but tires? Why the fuck do you guys all have multiple expensive bikes if nothing matters?
Just saying that the bike itself, the geo and intent of the bike, isn't far off what you have. You can easily throw slick tires on there to experience a "road bike" if you want to. Just an idea, cheaper way to try it out than going all in on another bike. If you want a dedicated roadie go for it though.
My cross bike is fine on road rides with the pavement slicks installed on it. It's actually even better than my $3200 carbon fiber Cervelo was because its more comfortable and stable. Which is why I sold that bike, there was no reason for me to have it anymore. Its a little slower on the climbs, sure, but I build more muscle because the bike weighs more and I don't race so meh.
Yeah, it's like mine except for having 4-5 tiers better components everywhere. That was the point. Still can fit 45mm tires and wide range gears but is ~5 lbs lighter and compatible with all the current stuff on the market. about the stock tires
troyguitar wrote: ↑Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:19 pm
Yeah, it's like mine except for having 4-5 tiers better components everywhere. That was the point. Still can fit 45mm tires and wide range gears but is ~5 lbs lighter and compatible with all the current stuff on the market. about the stock tires
my bike weighs 28 lbs according to my bathroom scale
If your goal is to be faster against the clock, yes you will be faster on a lighter bike.
is being held up by something.
. I'd cruise by in a t-shirt and cotton shorts cruising at 22 and just wonder what these kinds of people are doing spending so much money on something they suck at so badly. Now don't get me wrong, I'd occasionally get passed by some badass who'd fly by me like I'm standing still while I'm pushing like crazy to try to keep up, but those people clearly spent a lot more time riding than I do.
bike, fit, and kit would actually make even for me 
would make me a lot faster... I'm supposedly only doing 120ish watts in the first place. 
in concluding that better gear would actually make more of a difference for me than for you? A reduction in losses of X watts is going to represent way more percentage change in power "to the wheels" for me, plus the faster you go the more extra power it takes to make any difference anyway since drag is exponential. 
shit, Zil.
to build it up with a mix of whatever components - like maybe the new Shimano GRX "gravel" rear derailleur, some 
and whatnot.
about the stock tires