No one outside of CA wants EVs, they're rotting on lots. Plug-ins make sense for a lot more people.
Everything is rotting on lots right now. And Tesla is still selling 500k cars a qtr and not all are landing in Cali.
I think the main reason Evs are “rotting” is price. Pandemic times when everyone was trying to get one created the illusion for oems that there is an endless demand for 100k evs which frankly is false… but I think there are plenty of good use cases for most people to drive one. And no argument from a non ev owner will ever convince me otherwise.
I have driven 1 million miles or so in ICE cars and I prefer EVs after the last 2 years and 20k miles spent in them, it as it’s the superior mode of transport for anything “non fun” and roadtrips above 300 miles one way.
Clamoring to ICE cars is the equivalent of trying to ride a horse on the freeway.
ICE is superior in one way which is sound and feel. But that’s reserved for something like a Porsche enjoyed on the weekends. Which I’m in full support of. And no ev will ever be as “fun” as an ice sports car that’s light and sounds great. But that’s not the point here
It’s not really about better or worse. I have limited experience but would agree got a commuting appliance, an EV is probably better. But most people just don’t WANT one. Anyone I talk to just thinks it sounds hard to deal with (normals) or wants an engine/stick shift (car nerds). They only really seem to appeal to tech geeks, and I think those people all already bought one.
Agreed that price is also an issue. But it comes down to the same situation as all transport. People will just do whatever is easiest and/or cheapest. Hence why New Yorkers take the subway and people in Texas drive. I make it a point to bike as many places as I can in Charlotte but I get why no one else does - it’s dangerous and everyone thinks you’re crazy.
I never understood the need to go smaller than golf. Golf/gti is just perfectly sized for a small car. Anything smaller the mini has em beat in every way.
A modern polo is the size of a mk2 gti
Light=fun
We rented a Polo in europe a few years ago. Aside from the motor being absolute dogshit, the car was very enjoyable. It's a great size and super maneuverable. Quite fun to huck around actually. Despite the pathetic motor that was in ours.
I absolutely love the Buzz. The price, and EV only situation, is going to destroy it. If this thing was a hybrid at $45k they'd already be sold out for the next year.
I absolutely love the Buzz. The price, and EV only situation, is going to destroy it. If this thing was a hybrid at $45k they'd already be sold out for the next year.
sadly i think you are right. VW might be toast in the US at least.
Desertbreh wrote:
I'm happy for Brad because nobody jerks it to the Miata harder on this forum and that is the Crown Prince of Miatas.
D Griff wrote:
Inserting 'nobody jerks it harder to the Miata than Brad' quote.
I absolutely love the Buzz. The price, and EV only situation, is going to destroy it. If this thing was a hybrid at $45k they'd already be sold out for the next year.
sadly i think you are right. VW might be toast in the US at least.
One thing that's funny is the current Jetta is actually a great car. I've had a few rentals, they get real world 35-40 MPG, are decently quick with the turbo motor and drive pretty well. The interior is classic and I'd say above average for a car that costs sub $25K. They also have a regular old auto which is nice. For some reason the auto journalists hate them and love the Civic, I think I'd actually rather drive a Jetta if we're talking base-ish models. Civic Hybrid, R, and Si are definitely more desirable.
sadly i think you are right. VW might be toast in the US at least.
One thing that's funny is the current Jetta is actually a great car. I've had a few rentals, they get real world 35-40 MPG, are decently quick with the turbo motor and drive pretty well. The interior is classic and I'd say above average for a car that costs sub $25K. They also have a regular old auto which is nice. For some reason the auto journalists hate them and love the Civic, I think I'd actually rather drive a Jetta if we're talking base-ish models. Civic Hybrid, R, and Si are definitely more desirable.
The Jetta seems like it’s back at the top of its game of affordability and drive. But nobody wants sedans. The CVT plus NA 2.slow that actually went down in power again from the Civic sounds pretty terrible to me. I’d rather have the Jetta at that level. But on the upper trims yeah it seems the Civic is the better option.
I absolutely love the Buzz. The price, and EV only situation, is going to destroy it. If this thing was a hybrid at $45k they'd already be sold out for the next year.
sadly i think you are right. VW might be toast in the US at least.
I like Jason but I think he’s wrong here. The Buzz won’t save VW. A good Tiguan and Atlas will.
sadly i think you are right. VW might be toast in the US at least.
I like Jason but I think he’s wrong here. The Buzz won’t save VW. A good Tiguan and Atlas will.
I am with you, I think it could've if they'd done a $45K hybrid. It brings back the charm of VW from the 60s-90s that is all but lost today. I think VW filled a really special niche - basically appealing to people who wanted something a bit outside the status quo but maybe weren't committed to full enthusiast vehicles. I think Subaru has taken this over really well - they are a statement vehicle that says 'I love the outdoors, adventure, dogs, blah' and it really sells, even to people who give no shits about any of that stuff.
One thing that's funny is the current Jetta is actually a great car. I've had a few rentals, they get real world 35-40 MPG, are decently quick with the turbo motor and drive pretty well. The interior is classic and I'd say above average for a car that costs sub $25K. They also have a regular old auto which is nice. For some reason the auto journalists hate them and love the Civic, I think I'd actually rather drive a Jetta if we're talking base-ish models. Civic Hybrid, R, and Si are definitely more desirable.
The Jetta seems like it’s back at the top of its game of affordability and drive. But nobody wants sedans. The CVT plus NA 2.slow that actually went down in power again from the Civic sounds pretty terrible to me. I’d rather have the Jetta at that level. But on the upper trims yeah it seems the Civic is the better option.
Yep, the 2.0 CVT is pretty terrible, wouldn't rent again. It also got worse FE than a Jetta which is pathetic.
I absolutely love the Buzz. The price, and EV only situation, is going to destroy it. If this thing was a hybrid at $45k they'd already be sold out for the next year.
Or even $50K
Detroit wrote:Buy 911s instead of diamonds.
Johnny_P wrote: ↑Thu Feb 09, 2023 3:21 pm
Earn it and burn it, Val.
max225 wrote: ↑Mon May 01, 2023 5:35 pm
Yes it's a cool car. But prepare the lube/sawdust.
I like Jason but I think he’s wrong here. The Buzz won’t save VW. A good Tiguan and Atlas will.
I am with you, I think it could've if they'd done a $45K hybrid. It brings back the charm of VW from the 60s-90s that is all but lost today. I think VW filled a really special niche - basically appealing to people who wanted something a bit outside the status quo but maybe weren't committed to full enthusiast vehicles. I think Subaru has taken this over really well - they are a statement vehicle that says 'I love the outdoors, adventure, dogs, blah' and it really sells, even to people who give no shits about any of that stuff.
I think this is spot on, especially the bolded. Subaru ain't just for lesbians any more. Subi has done a great job carving this identity niche out for themselves. I know 3 people who've bought 4 Subarus in the last couple of years, 2 Foresters, an Outback, and a Cucktrek and they're quite happy with them. Even my bro, who has owned as many VW's as me over the last 40-odd years, is seriously considering dumping his JSW TDI with a Johnny-spec leaky sunroof for a Cucktrek. I think he's gonna , too. And I ain't gonna lie, if the new Imprezza RS had the BRZ motor I'd be pretty interested in it, too. Even with the CVT.
Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm
I don't understand anything anymore.
I am with you, I think it could've if they'd done a $45K hybrid. It brings back the charm of VW from the 60s-90s that is all but lost today. I think VW filled a really special niche - basically appealing to people who wanted something a bit outside the status quo but maybe weren't committed to full enthusiast vehicles. I think Subaru has taken this over really well - they are a statement vehicle that says 'I love the outdoors, adventure, dogs, blah' and it really sells, even to people who give no shits about any of that stuff.
I think this is spot on, especially the bolded. Subaru ain't just for lesbians any more. Subi has done a great job carving this identity niche out for themselves. I know 3 people who've bought 4 Subarus in the last couple of years, 2 Foresters, an Outback, and a Cucktrek and they're quite happy with them. Even my bro, who has owned as many VW's as me over the last 40-odd years, is seriously considering dumping his JSW TDI with a Johnny-spec leaky sunroof for a Cucktrek. I think he's gonna , too. And I ain't gonna lie, if the new Imprezza RS had the BRZ motor I'd be pretty interested in it, too. Even with the CVT.
I dunno if the BRZ motor is really something to lust after, it's kind of slow in a BRZ, let alone with a CuntVT and 1K more pounds.
I think this is spot on, especially the bolded. Subaru ain't just for lesbians any more. Subi has done a great job carving this identity niche out for themselves. I know 3 people who've bought 4 Subarus in the last couple of years, 2 Foresters, an Outback, and a Cucktrek and they're quite happy with them. Even my bro, who has owned as many VW's as me over the last 40-odd years, is seriously considering dumping his JSW TDI with a Johnny-spec leaky sunroof for a Cucktrek. I think he's gonna , too. And I ain't gonna lie, if the new Imprezza RS had the BRZ motor I'd be pretty interested in it, too. Even with the CVT.
I dunno if the BRZ motor is really something to lust after, it's kind of slow in a BRZ, let alone with a CuntVT and 1K more pounds.
I do like a Cucktrek though.
Not lusting after it per se, but 46 more hp is 46 more hp, and having that in the RS would be and match the hp in the Mk7.5 GTI.
Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm
I don't understand anything anymore.
I like Jason but I think he’s wrong here. The Buzz won’t save VW. A good Tiguan and Atlas will.
I am with you, I think it could've if they'd done a $45K hybrid. It brings back the charm of VW from the 60s-90s that is all but lost today. I think VW filled a really special niche - basically appealing to people who wanted something a bit outside the status quo but maybe weren't committed to full enthusiast vehicles. I think Subaru has taken this over really well - they are a statement vehicle that says 'I love the outdoors, adventure, dogs, blah' and it really sells, even to people who give no shits about any of that stuff.
Yeah but I think Subaru is going to be in some trouble soon as well. Their cars appeal to greenies but they have no hybrids or PHEV that is worth a damn. Supposedly changing soon I guess.
I don’t think the new beetle saved VW as much as them fully leaning into and owning the Euro trash stigma and turning out cars with personality. I mean the VeeDub commercials with the German scientist and techno music were hilarious but they added personality to every car at the time. The GTI got plaid seats. The Passat and Jetta were downright nice ass vehicles. 5 cylinder motors. Etc. It was the fact that they were doing stuff different that saved them.
, too. And I ain't gonna lie, if the new Imprezza RS had the BRZ motor I'd be pretty interested in it, too. Even with the CVT. 
and match the hp in the Mk7.5 GTI.