OT 12: Pew Pew Pew

[wap]

Yea they could be almost 6 ft long and weigh around 10 lbs. I'm good with people owning those. They're a major pain in the ass to load and fire.

just admit youre ignorant of historical weapons tech. Its cool. I'll wait.

What did I type in that sentence that was ignorant? How many 100-200 year old muzzle loaders have you fired?

[troyguitar]

I think that all laws need to be written/interpreted literally - and likely change more often as a result.

Totally reasonable just think of the downstream impact on stuff you like while we do that....

We live in the world we live in. I am more than willing to support change, but we can do steps now while we try and build eutopia. Throwing our hands up and taking an all or nothing approach is not useful.

You're the one who thinks kids should be shot so that you can feel like a man with your guns.

Guns have no place in the first world outside of law enforcement and the military. The "need" for them at the time of the 2nd amendment was due to a lack of police forces and standing armies. That need no longer exists.

[razr390]

You're the one who thinks kids should be shot so that you can feel like a man with your guns.

Guns have no place in the first world outside of law enforcement and the military. The "need" for them at the time of the 2nd amendment was due to a lack of police forces and standing armies. That need no longer exists.

Make me a proposal, Troy. Not a dream. A real proposal that might stand a chance of becoming law and would be Constitutional.

I've made FOUR. You've made zero. You're just as much a part of the problem as gun owners.

[troyguitar]

You're the one who thinks kids should be shot so that you can feel like a man with your guns.

Guns have no place in the first world outside of law enforcement and the military. The "need" for them at the time of the 2nd amendment was due to a lack of police forces and standing armies. That need no longer exists.

Make me a proposal, Troy. Not a dream. A real proposal that might stand a chance of becoming law and would be Constitutional.

I've made FOUR. You've made zero. You're just as much a part of the problem as gun owners.

Copy the gun laws from Canada.

[troyguitar]

Copy the gun laws from Canada.

Which isn't too far from the four I've suggested which tells me you don't even know their laws they just have fewer gun crimes so you think they are better.

I'd be fine with that approach and it would likely be Constitutional. It would be almost impossible to get through congress but I'd support it.

Copying Canada is a baby step toward eliminating guns entirely from civilians, not an end goal.

The fact is that we will NEVER see reasonable gun laws here - Not even baby steps. It won't happen. Too many morans combined with too many powerful fear mongers keeping the morans up in arms.

[troyguitar]

Copying Canada is a baby step toward eliminating guns entirely from civilians, not an end goal.

The fact is that we will NEVER see reasonable gun laws here - Not even baby steps. It won't happen. Too many morans combined with too many powerful fear mongers keeping the morans up in arms.

Keep your eye on the real goal. The real goal is eliminating gun violence and long term eliminating violence in general.

Guns are a piece of this but not the full package. Baby steps DO matter and will save real lives.

We will never even see baby steps. It's hopeless. Gun nuts will NEVER relent.

[goIftdibrad]

Are we talking pistols or rifles?

FWIW an 18th century rifle is generally speaking far more powerful and no less accurate than a modern weapon. A .62 bullet out of a Kentucky Rifle would leave a hole in you that there is generally no coming back from, even with modern medicine. They were nasty nasty guns.

And fired what, 3-6 rounds per minute as long as the powder was dry and the flint made it's spark.

more like 2.

but its not about the power...its about the common man having access to infantry grade weapons.

[troyguitar]

We will never even see baby steps. It's hopeless. Gun nuts will NEVER relent.

They don't need to. Many gun owners are like me.

The key to doing that is a reasonable position (which I'd easy to get to and I think you have) and an argument that doesn't alienate the MANY "logical" gun owners out there. It's as much style as substance.

Treating someone like me as the enemy when I am your ideal ally is a sure fire way to get to failure.

You need 50% + 1 to win. Not 100%

It has nothing to do with you and me, we're not in office and neither of us ever could be... The people who are in office have shown that they are unwilling to pass anything and the people have shown that they will continue to support representatives who never do anything. We, the country in general, don't want to improve anything.

[4zilch]

You can't easily conceal it either.

Yea they could be almost 6 ft long and weigh around 10 lbs. I'm good with people owning those. They're a major pain in the ass to load and fire.

I have a modern muzzle loader, complete pain in the ass to load and fire. Not to mention cleaning the damn thing. They also explode from time to time in users face.

[troyguitar]

I firmly believe that we will not fix anything in our lifetime. The only hope to improve society in a measureable way is to eliminate the stranglehold of religion. Teaching kids to believe in fairy tales against all evidence is the root problem here and makes the citizenry in general unable to think critically.

[KYGTIGuy]

I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and Constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.

~KYGTIGuy

[4zilch]

I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and Constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.

~KYGTIGuy

You’re Thomas Jefferson? : mindblown:

[KYGTIGuy]

I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and Constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.

~KYGTIGuy

You’re Thomas Jefferson? : mindblown:

Hmm, wha?

[SAWCE]

I firmly believe that we will not fix anything in our lifetime. The only hope to improve society in a measureable way is to eliminate the stranglehold of religion. Teaching kids to believe in fairy tales against all evidence is the root problem here and makes the citizenry in general unable to think critically.

Religion is the root cause of mass shootings?

Other coutries are highly religious too, and yet ours is the only one where this regularly happen.. Not buying that religion is the root of the problem here. Try again.

[KYGTIGuy]

Took my kids to an indoor playground today. Some kid pissed in the ball pit.

Still better than Chucky cheese.

[SAWCE]

Took my kids to an indoor playground today. Some kid pissed in the ball pit.

Still better than Chucky cheese.

Did you see it, or just smell it? Kinda funny to picture a kid standing next to the pit, dropping trou, and just whipping it out to piss in there.

[KYGTIGuy]

Took my kids to an indoor playground today. Some kid pissed in the ball pit.

Still better than Chucky cheese.

Did you see it, or just smell it? Kinda funny to picture a kid standing next to the pit, dropping trou, and just whipping it out to piss in there.

Staff came up to the parents standing around the pit and asked them to remove their kids. They then pointed out wet footprints coming from out of the pit. A mom next to me grabbed her kid and was like "yeah, he's wet" as in her been sitting in something.

They emptied the pit and cleaned it and added new balls.

[troyguitar]

I firmly believe that we will not fix anything in our lifetime. The only hope to improve society in a measureable way is to eliminate the stranglehold of religion. Teaching kids to believe in fairy tales against all evidence is the root problem here and makes the citizenry in general unable to think critically.

Religion is the root cause of mass shootings?

Other coutries are highly religious too, and yet ours is the only one where this regularly happen.. Not buying that religion is the root of the problem here. Try again.

Religion is why we can't make rational decisions, which is why we have insane gun laws. You not buying it doesn't make it wrong. IIRC you're one of the brainwashed children of so of course you wouldn't buy it.

[SAWCE]

Did you see it, or just smell it? Kinda funny to picture a kid standing next to the pit, dropping trou, and just whipping it out to piss in there.

Staff came up to the parents standing around the put and asked them to remove their kids. They then pointed out wet footprints coming from out of the pit. A mom next to me grabbed her kid and was like "yeah, he's wet" as in her been sitting in something.

They emptied the pit and cleaned it and added new balls.

Lol gross..

One time lifeguarding we saw a kid coming out of the locker rooms to the pool and noticed one of his footprints looked different than the other.. there was a rule that you had to shower before getting in the pool, which is why they were wet at all. As he got closer we asked to look at his feet, and he had stepped in shit with one of them. Went into the locker room, and sure enough, there was a smushed turd in the shower.

[SAWCE]

Religion is the root cause of mass shootings?

Other coutries are highly religious too, and yet ours is the only one where this regularly happen.. Not buying that religion is the root of the problem here. Try again.

Religion is why we can't make rational decisions, which is why we have insane gun laws. You not buying it doesn't make it wrong. IIRC you're one of the brainwashed children of so of course you wouldn't buy it.

I mean, I grew up religious, but I don't go anymore, and would like to think that I can think for myself (I probably can't ) I'll agree that a lot of religious views are outdated, but from what I've seen of friends and family who are still religious, their religions at least, have made huge steps towards being more progressive since I last went as a teenager. Trying to erradicate a faith that people have becuase you don't agree with it and think that it makes all of them incapable of making rational decisions is pretty short-sighted and over-generalizing.

[Calvinball]

Religion is the root cause of mass shootings?

Other coutries are highly religious too, and yet ours is the only one where this regularly happen.. Not buying that religion is the root of the problem here. Try again.

Religion is why we can't make rational decisions, which is why we have insane gun laws. You not buying it doesn't make it wrong. IIRC you're one of the brainwashed children of so of course you wouldn't buy it.

I’m just not following you on this one. Being raised with religion inhibits critical thinking?


Sent from the Beer Depository

[troyguitar]

Religion is why we can't make rational decisions, which is why we have insane gun laws. You not buying it doesn't make it wrong. IIRC you're one of the brainwashed children of so of course you wouldn't buy it.

I mean, I grew up religious, but I don't go anymore, and would like to think that I can think for myself (I probably can't ) I'll agree that a lot of religious views are outdated, but from what I've seen of friends and family who are still religious, their religions at least, have made huge steps towards being more progressive since I last went as a teenager. Trying to erradicate a faith that people have becuase you don't agree with it and think that it makes all of them incapable of making rational decisions is pretty short-sighted and over-generalizing.

Feelings being taught to be equivalent to is the biggest problem here, and it comes directly from religion. It ought to be a crime to teach kids that shit.

[CorvetteWaxer]

Boy, this thread became a clusterfuck of supposed facts today.

How about them Kardashians?

[troyguitar]

Religion is why we can't make rational decisions, which is why we have insane gun laws. You not buying it doesn't make it wrong. IIRC you're one of the brainwashed children of so of course you wouldn't buy it.

I’m just not following you on this one. Being raised with religion inhibits critical thinking?


Sent from the Beer Depository

Where are you having trouble? Religion teaches kids that if you believe something to be true, then it is true.

[SAWCE]

I mean, I grew up religious, but I don't go anymore, and would like to think that I can think for myself (I probably can't ) I'll agree that a lot of religious views are outdated, but from what I've seen of friends and family who are still religious, their religions at least, have made huge steps towards being more progressive since I last went as a teenager. Trying to erradicate a faith that people have becuase you don't agree with it and think that it makes all of them incapable of making rational decisions is pretty short-sighted and over-generalizing.

Feelings being taught to be equivalent to is the biggest problem here, and it comes directly from religion. It ought to be a crime to teach kids that shit.

I guess that’s where I have a hard time agree with you. Mormons are taught to pray about everything we’re taught and try to decide for ourselves if we believe it and to develop our own testimony and faith, not just accept everything taught to us as truth. So my religious experience is very different than what you’ve encountered or heard.