Android Auto/ACP Discussion Thread

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troyguitar wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:42 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:33 pm

:notwrong:
Subarus are the cars that climb Mt Washington.
I climbed Mt. Washington!

...On their cog railway doe
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:16 pm
Johnny_P wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:39 pm

Yeah that's the way old spec U Connect works and its rather :disgust:
I don't understand it on the charger / 300... there's a ton of wasted cheap shitty plastic space all over. Plenty of room for a damn seat heater button.
Those buttons are real variable cost. People still buy the cars despite it, so :scrooge:
How many pennies can they add to the cost of a car?
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:48 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:16 pm
Those buttons are real variable cost. People still buy the cars despite it, so :scrooge:
How many pennies can they add to the cost of a car?
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:10 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:48 pm

How many pennies can they add to the cost of a car?
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
That must be frustrating as fuck fighting that (losing) battle. I'd gladly pay a few bucks more for a car for more real switches and buttons on the dash. Hell, if it costs $4, charge $5. Instant 25% profit! :math:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:15 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:10 pm
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
That must be frustrating as fuck fighting that (losing) battle. I'd gladly pay a few bucks more for a car for more real switches and buttons on the dash. Hell, if it costs $4, charge $5. Instant 25% profit! :math:
Same, but until people stop buying cars and cite that as a key reason...or I can get some sort of data proving that people will pay more for switches, it’s a losing battle.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:18 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:15 pm

That must be frustrating as fuck fighting that (losing) battle. I'd gladly pay a few bucks more for a car for more real switches and buttons on the dash. Hell, if it costs $4, charge $5. Instant 25% profit! :math:
Same, but until people stop buying cars and cite that as a key reason...or I can get some sort of data proving that people will pay more for switches, it’s a losing battle.
:rage: :(
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:23 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:18 pm
Same, but until people stop buying cars and cite that as a key reason...or I can get some sort of data proving that people will pay more for switches, it’s a losing battle.
:rage: :(
Welcome to my world...
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:43 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:23 pm

:rage: :(
Welcome to my world...
:hellno:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:54 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:43 pm
Welcome to my world...
:hellno:
Seriously, my gig is best for people that view cars the same way as they view microwaves... :aintcare:
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:58 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:54 pm

:hellno:
Seriously, my gig is best for people that view cars the same way as they view microwaves... :aintcare:
So much :|
I understand how you want to blow your brains out sometimes :lol:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:10 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:48 pm

How many pennies can they add to the cost of a car?
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
My issue isn't the movement of the HVAC controls to the screen. I get why they do it. It looks impressive as hell too when you compare it to other cars in the class with tiny, wimpy low res screens.

I'd prefer switches, but that's a minor problem. The bigger problem is actually the UI. There are so many little, stupid things that could very easily be fixed. If they gave me the prototype, I could have listed the 5 common complaints that people will have in 5 minutes of fiddling with it. I just don't know what their UI design and validation looks like, but some of this is so obvious and basic.

Subaru just got HAMMERED on JD Power for this new screen. It's so bad, Subaru is sending out surveys on what everyone hates about it. Sure enough, the most obvious UI concerns everyone has are all listed as things they're trying to improve and want people to rank priority. So I'm hopeful it'll get improved over time, just have zero idea how this shipped like this.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:58 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:58 pm
Seriously, my gig is best for people that view cars the same way as they view microwaves... :aintcare:
So much :|
I understand how you want to blow your brains out sometimes :lol:
I need to change industries desperately. Too bad the only thing anyone values anymore is digital/software crap. There’s no interest in building actual things now.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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MrH42 wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:04 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:10 pm
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
My issue isn't the movement of the HVAC controls to the screen. I get why they do it. It looks impressive as hell too when you compare it to other cars in the class with tiny, wimpy low res screens.

I'd prefer switches, but that's a minor problem. The bigger problem is actually the UI. There are so many little, stupid things that could very easily be fixed. If they gave me the prototype, I could have listed the 5 common complaints that people will have in 5 minutes of fiddling with it. I just don't know what their UI design and validation looks like, but some of this is so obvious and basic.

Subaru just got HAMMERED on JD Power for this new screen. It's so bad, Subaru is sending out surveys on what everyone hates about it. Sure enough, the most obvious UI concerns everyone has are all listed as things they're trying to improve and want people to rank priority. So I'm hopeful it'll get improved over time, just have zero idea how this shipped like this.
Because everything is designed by committee. The HVAC folks are battling with the radio folks who are battling with the nav/infotainment folks for superiority. So instead of developing one product that rules, you get a mediocre thing that requires multiple steps to accomplish anything so everyone loses.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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MrH42 wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:04 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:10 pm
Well, it’s not just the switches, but what’s behind those switches. Managing the number of different wiring harnesses for a vehicle is a real cost. So every vehicle that gets heated seats would need a unique dashboard (or wherever the switch is) wiring harness, vs a vehicle that uses the CANBUS system through infotainment can all use the same harness (seat harnesses are different, obviously).

So the switch itself is probably a few bucks per car, but since the plant needs to manage more wiring harnesses, there’s a cost associated with that...probably a few bucks per car ALL CARS.

FWIW I agree with you and battle this constantly. The above is what I have to overcome.
My issue isn't the movement of the HVAC controls to the screen. I get why they do it. It looks impressive as hell too when you compare it to other cars in the class with tiny, wimpy low res screens.

I'd prefer switches, but that's a minor problem. The bigger problem is actually the UI. There are so many little, stupid things that could very easily be fixed. If they gave me the prototype, I could have listed the 5 common complaints that people will have in 5 minutes of fiddling with it. I just don't know what their UI design and validation looks like, but some of this is so obvious and basic.

Subaru just got HAMMERED on JD Power for this new screen. It's so bad, Subaru is sending out surveys on what everyone hates about it. Sure enough, the most obvious UI concerns everyone has are all listed as things they're trying to improve and want people to rank priority. So I'm hopeful it'll get improved over time, just have zero idea how this shipped like this.
Truly baffling.
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:05 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:58 pm

So much :|
I understand how you want to blow your brains out sometimes :lol:
I need to change industries desperately. Too bad the only thing anyone values anymore is digital/software crap. There’s no interest in building actual things now.
Yea. :(
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:08 pm
MrH42 wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:04 pm

My issue isn't the movement of the HVAC controls to the screen. I get why they do it. It looks impressive as hell too when you compare it to other cars in the class with tiny, wimpy low res screens.

I'd prefer switches, but that's a minor problem. The bigger problem is actually the UI. There are so many little, stupid things that could very easily be fixed. If they gave me the prototype, I could have listed the 5 common complaints that people will have in 5 minutes of fiddling with it. I just don't know what their UI design and validation looks like, but some of this is so obvious and basic.

Subaru just got HAMMERED on JD Power for this new screen. It's so bad, Subaru is sending out surveys on what everyone hates about it. Sure enough, the most obvious UI concerns everyone has are all listed as things they're trying to improve and want people to rank priority. So I'm hopeful it'll get improved over time, just have zero idea how this shipped like this.
Because everything is designed by committee. The HVAC folks are battling with the radio folks who are battling with the nav/infotainment folks for superiority. So instead of developing one product that rules, you get a mediocre thing that requires multiple steps to accomplish anything so everyone loses.
Reading this makes me :rage: so bad. Why can't there be an overriding UI manager to rein in all these disparate clowns and make final, good decisions for the consumer? :disgust:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:11 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:08 pm
Because everything is designed by committee. The HVAC folks are battling with the radio folks who are battling with the nav/infotainment folks for superiority. So instead of developing one product that rules, you get a mediocre thing that requires multiple steps to accomplish anything so everyone loses.
Reading this makes me :rage: so bad. Why can't there be an overriding UI manager to rein in all these disparate clowns and make final, good decisions for the consumer? :disgust:
Good companies would, but there’s really no good car companies left.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:13 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:11 pm

Reading this makes me :rage: so bad. Why can't there be an overriding UI manager to rein in all these disparate clowns and make final, good decisions for the consumer? :disgust:
Good companies would, but there’s really no good car companies left.
Le :(
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:21 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:13 pm
Good companies would, but there’s really no good car companies left.
Le :(
:dat:

Working for Jeep broke my heart.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:05 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:58 pm

So much :|
I understand how you want to blow your brains out sometimes :lol:
I need to change industries desperately. Too bad the only thing anyone values anymore is digital/software crap. There’s no interest in building actual things now.
Why do you think I build drugs now? :scrooge:
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:08 pm
Because everything is designed by committee. The HVAC folks are battling with the radio folks who are battling with the nav/infotainment folks for superiority. So instead of developing one product that rules, you get a mediocre thing that requires multiple steps to accomplish anything so everyone loses.
That's exactly it. You see the seat heater buttons at the bottom? You would think you just press there to cycle through the low, med, high on the seat heaters, right? NOPE. You press that, and what happens? A secondary menu pops up that covered the whole screen. And shows the seat in a really big image. And then the button you press to cycle through the settings are in a different location than the corner.

So if you're driving, you have to press the seat heater button, then look down to find where the button is on this new sub menu. It's insane. But I agree. I guarantee some guy working on the HVAC control system really pitched how sweet these graphics in the sub menu looked. Awful usability.

Watch Yuri and Jacob try to use it: https://youtu.be/vlIi8xMpvZs?t=755
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:24 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:21 pm
Le :(
:dat:

Working for Jeep broke my heart.
For a company that makes such :fuckyeah: products, the behind-the-scenes stuff that you've shared here is just such monumental amounts of :wtf: :| :butwhy: :ayfkm: :amaze: :mindblown: :really: :facepalm: :( :nope: :rage: :angry: :fshitup:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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MrH42 wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:24 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:05 pm
I need to change industries desperately. Too bad the only thing anyone values anymore is digital/software crap. There’s no interest in building actual things now.
Why do you think I build drugs now? :scrooge:
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:08 pm
Because everything is designed by committee. The HVAC folks are battling with the radio folks who are battling with the nav/infotainment folks for superiority. So instead of developing one product that rules, you get a mediocre thing that requires multiple steps to accomplish anything so everyone loses.
That's exactly it. You see the seat heater buttons at the bottom? You would think you just press there to cycle through the low, med, high on the seat heaters, right? NOPE. You press that, and what happens? A secondary menu pops up that covered the whole screen. And shows the seat in a really big image. And then the button you press to cycle through the settings are in a different location than the corner.

So if you're driving, you have to press the seat heater button, then look down to find where the button is on this new sub menu. It's insane. But I agree. I guarantee some guy working on the HVAC control system really pitched how sweet these graphics in the sub menu looked. Awful usability.

Watch Yuri and Jacob try to use it: https://youtu.be/vlIi8xMpvZs?t=755
Yep. And on the UConnect I had it was yet another tap or 2 to get back to the screen you were originally on. So 4-5 times you had to take your eyes off the road for 1 simple task. :facepalm:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:28 pm
Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:24 pm
:dat:

Working for Jeep broke my heart.
For a company that makes such :fuckyeah: products, the behind-the-scenes stuff that you've shared here is just such monumental amounts of :wtf: :| :butwhy: :ayfkm: :amaze: :mindblown: :really: :facepalm: :( :nope: :rage: :angry: :fshitup:
it is completely beyond me how the products are so cool. Accident? Maybe Sergio forced them through? It’s baffling to me right now.
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:30 pm
MrH42 wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:24 pm

Why do you think I build drugs now? :scrooge:



That's exactly it. You see the seat heater buttons at the bottom? You would think you just press there to cycle through the low, med, high on the seat heaters, right? NOPE. You press that, and what happens? A secondary menu pops up that covered the whole screen. And shows the seat in a really big image. And then the button you press to cycle through the settings are in a different location than the corner.

So if you're driving, you have to press the seat heater button, then look down to find where the button is on this new sub menu. It's insane. But I agree. I guarantee some guy working on the HVAC control system really pitched how sweet these graphics in the sub menu looked. Awful usability.

Watch Yuri and Jacob try to use it: https://youtu.be/vlIi8xMpvZs?t=755
Yep. And on the UConnect I had it was yet another tap or 2 to get back to the screen you were originally on. So 4-5 times you had to take your eyes off the road for 1 simple task. :facepalm:
I had a Cherokee to evaluate this winter with that system. I found it infuriating. But it pushes people to want higher trims, so it’s fine.

:hellno: :rage:
Desertbreh wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:40 pm My guess would be that Chris took some time off because he has read the dialogue on this page 1,345 times and decided to spend some of his free time doing something besides beating a horse to death.
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Detroit wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:45 pm
wap wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:30 pm

Yep. And on the UConnect I had it was yet another tap or 2 to get back to the screen you were originally on. So 4-5 times you had to take your eyes off the road for 1 simple task. :facepalm:
I had a Cherokee to evaluate this winter with that system. I found it infuriating. But it pushes people to want higher trims, so it’s fine.

:hellno: :rage:
:disgust:
:wap: Where are these mangos?
Detroit wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:19 pm I don't understand anything anymore.
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